Salt Spring Island Archives

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Tom & Kay Butt (1908-) (1912-)

This recording is part of the Salt Spring Island Sound Archives Project.

Accession Number Interviewer Ruth Sandwell
Date August 1, 1990 Location 981 Fulford Ganges Road
Media tape Audio CD mp3
ID 74 Topic




Unknown Speaker 0:00
Today is August the first 1990 and today I'm talking to Kay and Tom but at their home on Roland road and your Fulford My name is Ruth Sandwell. Why don't we start with you're telling me how you first well first of all, where where were you born? That that's a good place to start.

Unknown Speaker 0:24
I was born in California. We're about Nevada City.

Unknown Speaker 0:35
What about you? So where did you two meet?

Unknown Speaker 0:40
Well, my parents were home study in the state. And then a year after I was born in Canada, in Vancouver, so I only spent about a year in the States.

Unknown Speaker 0:57
Oh, yeah. venue. Then you came up to Canada. And in Vancouver, not. They settled first in Vancouver. So 1909

Unknown Speaker 1:10
That would be nice. Yeah, about 1909 I guess it would be. And then my dad was working the building superintendent on Hastings Street and they get less. Until 19/14, I guess, when the first world war started, be volunteer. And then he went overseas in 1916 I guess. He joins us Seaforth Highlanders in Vancouver. And then he was wounded in 1918 and died of wounds in 1980.

Unknown Speaker 2:00
Did he come back home? Overseas

Unknown Speaker 2:03
very depressed.

Unknown Speaker 2:07
So your mom was left then with how many children? Did she have? A brother night? Okay, I'm gonna I'll ask a bit about her. Get her early history there quick. So you were born in Winnipeg?

Unknown Speaker 2:23
Yes. We came up to West Vancouver in 1920. Am I believe you were out here about the same time that we had. We lived there until 1940. I guess we're married in the meantime in 1935. Is that long? Oh. Stay quiet.

Unknown Speaker 2:59
No, We'd lived in an eighth district called Grandview lumber in Vancouver and then we moved to West Vancouver. That's Oh, I go to Hawaii. Was that?

Unknown Speaker 3:14
How did you why did your family move to West Vancouver? Oh, I

Unknown Speaker 3:18
think because of the weather mostly? Yes. It was very different. wet and rainy the year we came up very nicely.

Unknown Speaker 3:30
No, I live in first one to wet sand. It was no bridges. And

Unknown Speaker 3:35
there's a ferry across.

Unknown Speaker 3:37
Nevertheless, there before you ran from Ambleside into into the foot of Carroll street. But you know, Columbia? I don't know Columbia, South Carolina. I was working in tonus time. So we take this very early in the morning. What happened our trip? Walk up town to work

Unknown Speaker 4:02
occurred about that period, I

Unknown Speaker 4:03
suppose then later on. They built the second house bridge. So we walked in. We go across that model to that guy. And then later develop the first now's when the goodness is built that was that. Right? Well, then we were only about 15 minutes from top

Unknown Speaker 4:26
change. So you you were married in what year 1935. So how did you come to Salt Spring?

Unknown Speaker 4:39
Well, I think it was before the war started, wasn't it? Tommy began to think about getting out of debt and Coover.

Unknown Speaker 4:47
Where were you working at the time?

Unknown Speaker 4:50
I was working on the stock exchange. I manage the clearing house for the Vancouver Stock Exchange. Went through the boom and bust. Woman 2829 bustin 30 My brother was trader Scott. So that set up in the 30s and he advertised her property on the Gulf Islands waterfront property. Hundreds of replies visited all over the place in Hornby Island island where else Bender Of course, Eliana we ended up doctoring.

Unknown Speaker 5:38
So you were looking for a new way to make a living then

Unknown Speaker 5:41
actually, we're thinking of some resorts that eventually bought a property down it was

Unknown Speaker 5:50
like, we're about some Western like, was it?

Unknown Speaker 5:54
It was on the side of Western Lake

Unknown Speaker 6:02
when you drive along the road, you can look across you

Unknown Speaker 6:05
know what? I eventually got

Unknown Speaker 6:07
it anyway, this was about your property afterwards. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 6:11
Okay. This we bought it from a social the soldier settlement bar. Oh, really. They definitely sold it to various soldiers. None of them made a go of it. So we bought bought it from them. And it was a sea of 320 acres. And about three quarters of a mile around this side of the lake. So we moved up here and we the old farmhouse had fairly big bedrooms upstairs. So we cut those into and make more room to build a few cabins around the lake and started a summer.

Unknown Speaker 7:07
So you can either had done that kind of work before.

Unknown Speaker 7:10
No, no, no, no.

Unknown Speaker 7:14
Did you have any other family here?

Unknown Speaker 7:17
Oh, yes. My brother and his mother and my sister. Were two brothers married to two sisters. Oh, so what's your sister's name? Molly, Mary.

Unknown Speaker 7:31
I don't think I asked you what your your name was before you were married.

Unknown Speaker 7:37
So anyway, they were up here one year before we were I have my first baby now in West Vancouver. And by the time she was nine months, we came up here.

Unknown Speaker 7:49
So what year was that?

Unknown Speaker 7:52
19 4040 I think

Unknown Speaker 7:56
so when you came here, there was the there was an old house and you just kind of renovated it.

Unknown Speaker 8:03
Well, we didn't do too much to it. But

Unknown Speaker 8:05
you know, we didn't do too much either. That's just not to get more room. So the previous tenant there was back into it. Yes, yeah.

Unknown Speaker 8:22
Well, he was about to before us, I think two or three before us. But he McGregor Macintosh he he was very popular in Salt Spring Island. Used to come over to all the veterans affairs Armistice Day in the residence celebration. But he he evidently put up the fireplace in the house. He had one arm and his other arm was damaged she had one and it was quite high wasn't that tall

Unknown Speaker 8:58
Oh 50 feet I get

Unknown Speaker 9:01
this chimney on the house

Unknown Speaker 9:06
when you first got there were there any I guess there was no plumbing?

Unknown Speaker 9:10
Yes plumbing Yes, we had plumbing. What were we doing with that outside? Oh, that was an extra I guess but this was in the house. Plumbing no electrical

Unknown Speaker 9:24
yes it was It wasn't proper septic tank anything of that sort of a cesspool in the garden wouldn't it?

Unknown Speaker 9:30
Well, yes. They call it a septic tank so

Unknown Speaker 9:34
and you have piped water from the lake or well yeah, we pump water from the lake and no electricity though. No,

Unknown Speaker 9:45
no, no, no for a long while. Eventually we got it.

Unknown Speaker 9:50
Do you remember when you got it?

Unknown Speaker 9:52
Wrong the T 5456. Sometime like that. They had that down? Then Fulford but nothing came up

Unknown Speaker 10:04
yeah we had a meeting we had a meeting one trying to get the line extended from for for doubt out to be reappointed until I got stuck with the job of negotiating with idle and I worked on that for about two or three years we get people signed up and you don't have to guarantee to pay so much according to the districts that are out there and we get a lot of signatures and somebody would drop out drop out but anyway, finally made a deal with the Japanese hydro that was managing it and about half the people had dropped out but the rest of us put up the extra money or guaranteed extra money and the random lineup says it's got out to us everybody else wanted it so all the rescue

Unknown Speaker 11:14
was it was the money for the just for installation or did you have to pay well the survey they

Unknown Speaker 11:18
put in their own poles for instance, Charles paid for them so we got our own poles out of the bush we were about half a mile from the main road. We had this guy's holes

Unknown Speaker 11:29
I think you're making a squeak down so I guess that all picks up this

Unknown Speaker 11:39
How about a telephone? Oh

Unknown Speaker 11:44
Shall we good service

Unknown Speaker 11:48
Yeah, I bet that was the one that you Okay, can you go up to Central

Unknown Speaker 11:52
Europe and guarantees and if you do anything for you wanted to phone somebody should know if they were out or not?

Unknown Speaker 12:01
It's really good. She did a phone up until you what your bill was to have you forgotten

Unknown Speaker 12:12
was the service to telephone service? Was it just in the day then? Do you remember what it was? Oh, no. All day and night?

Unknown Speaker 12:21
Yes. I don't know how they did with the operators up there. Because I think Phoenix was the the one wasn't I

Unknown Speaker 12:35
think later they hired on some more. Yeah. And then they had to shift and and things later. But so you ran the lodge and it was a summer resort. Who who would come to stay with you? Was it the same people? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 12:53
mostly. Mostly from Vancouver. And sometimes people from farther away and the same people come back every every year but we only run it for about three years. We got fed up with it. My father pulled out

Unknown Speaker 13:10
so you were running it together with your brother.

Unknown Speaker 13:12
So we quit the business? I started farming

Unknown Speaker 13:16
really at your property up there What were you farming?

Unknown Speaker 13:25
Oh, a little bit of

Unknown Speaker 13:26
everything. Mostly sheep. Pigs and colic two or three cows. They garden. Did you potato story stores here.

Unknown Speaker 13:39
Would you sell most of your produce?

Unknown Speaker 13:42
Yep, yes. cream eggs to the creamery. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 13:49
creamy butter cream up on the road on the spin and they pick it up. Pick it up make butter

Unknown Speaker 13:59
but would you just use the milk for yourself?

Unknown Speaker 14:03
Or make cream and then ship the cream up to the creamery they picked it up on the roadside no fever point rolled it once a week I think it was

Unknown Speaker 14:16
how much would they pay for that

Unknown Speaker 14:22
but I guess it was you know the going price

Unknown Speaker 14:25
to get our butter back sometimes we didn't have much cash besides the butter but saved making butter

Unknown Speaker 14:34
so what happened to all the all the little cabins that you'd built?

Unknown Speaker 14:39
Oh, we didn't build that many. But two or three when my mother lived in whenever done like three with

Unknown Speaker 14:53
the two at the lake and log cabin and one one across the way a bit.

Unknown Speaker 15:00
So they were just left empty.

Unknown Speaker 15:03
Well, people used to come stay in the summertime. You know, when the people that had come to the resort, some of them used to come. We had one family that came there every year we were there. So how

Unknown Speaker 15:14
long was it? How long did you have it? Is it have people coming to stay? Yeah, all together,

Unknown Speaker 15:21
oh, just about three years. But then we went on and rented the cabins, if I for whatever, we didn't bother advertising during

Unknown Speaker 15:30
that time, we were feeding them and everything. For them, when they

Unknown Speaker 15:35
were in the house that started, that must have been quite a job.

Unknown Speaker 15:41
You remember what we were getting something like $25 a week, rolling forward for a week, three meals a day.

Unknown Speaker 15:50
It was during the war, you know, rationing came along. That's another reason we stopped. We were supposed to pick up all these visitors ration cards to buy, you know, tea, coffee, sugar, things like that. So that got to be quite a hassle to get enough ration cards. And

Unknown Speaker 16:13
so when you when you went there, and we're running it as a as a resort, how many children did you have that?

Unknown Speaker 16:20
Well, my brother and my sister had two girls, and they were living there too. Yes, I had the one. And then what's her name?

Unknown Speaker 16:29
Was it her? Sister know you're your child? Oh, Christine.

Unknown Speaker 16:35
Yes. And then while we were running, and I had two more children. So what did any Kathleen and Charles What years were they born? The quiz. We're talking about that the other day. Well, how would

Unknown Speaker 16:57
you maybe you can remember by thinking how long you'd been here. Before they were born. The first one was nine months old when you came?

Unknown Speaker 17:04
Yes. She was born in 1939. And my next the next girl was born. Kathy was born in 1919 42. And I think Charles was born in 1943.

Unknown Speaker 17:31
So they're all quite young, you must have been pretty busy.

Unknown Speaker 17:35
Yes, I think I got out of a lot of work at that time.

Unknown Speaker 17:43
Seven days a week. It's lucky we had a bookstore at the end of the year.

Unknown Speaker 17:50
It's the same now. The pharmacy is I suppose so. We're pretty hard. But so you had your your sister, your sister and her family were here to

Unknown Speaker 18:03
just at the time we were in the resort for about three years. Did they live in

Unknown Speaker 18:07
the house with you? Or did they live in a in a cabin? Yeah, we

Unknown Speaker 18:13
we did have a little house

Unknown Speaker 18:15
we had a little place off. On the big house. Molly and Jack lived in the I was reluctant Miss Lola which we later converted to a chicken house

Unknown Speaker 18:29
down here. So I did have to put something else.

Unknown Speaker 18:36
When did it get burned down?

Unknown Speaker 18:38
Kay sister was a great swimmer and diver. We built it. When we had the resort we built a big swimming pool floating swimming pool down like that. She gave lessons to the swimming and diving. So she didn't do that.

Unknown Speaker 19:00
So how did how did your house burned down?

Unknown Speaker 19:04
Well, the little one this was later on. When we were renting cameras out and the family moved there and

Unknown Speaker 19:14
yeah, we had a family from Hong Kong. And Shanghai Oh, God used to this woman used to come up almost every day didn't she could talk to you to give up one day and then look down there was smoke coming out of it. Thinking she left a fire on her something holding went up.

Unknown Speaker 19:35
I think she was trying to dry some clothes. It was sort of a rainy, rainy day. She thought enough about the stove volunteer. A cool place to split up.

Unknown Speaker 19:49
So when you were running the place as a resort and you had to provide meals were you would you do most of the cooking Are you in your sister?

Unknown Speaker 19:57
No we we I hired a cook before we started and we finally got one about two weeks before we started and just to sort of break around and my sister was doing most of the breaking this girl didn't turn out to be to satisfactory. So she let her go and then there was a friend of Tom's mother, mothers that came up he used to cook in the lumber camp. And he said he would take on the Cooking which he did with with your mother helping him she she would be there at the same time you know, so it was the two of them that really started and went at it. Yeah, yeah, I think so.

Unknown Speaker 20:53
So who was doing most of the you must have had things like laundry and things to do for the guests in those years when they were when you had the resort

Unknown Speaker 21:01
as well we could send that out

Unknown Speaker 21:04
but where would you send it to?

Unknown Speaker 21:07
I don't know whether it was because I want to get you to think but yes I think so. And then the we had no electricity so no no fridge or anything like that. We just had that the old ice blocks with ice and what would you cook

Unknown Speaker 21:27
on all big

Unknown Speaker 21:29
stone wood stove yeah

Unknown Speaker 21:35
we bought a big old range from Montreal great big massive thing very very heavy weight over about 1200 pounds so the whole time we're there

Unknown Speaker 21:59
so what when you when you had the resort like during those three years what what would you do Tom there what yeah, what what work would you do there like we owe it to guests are

Unknown Speaker 22:15
we well there's all kinds of work to do. I mean, we had animals we had cars and things

Unknown Speaker 22:21
like right from the beginning Sure enough

Unknown Speaker 22:26
garden stuff like that did to do a certain amount of work keeping up the cabins and

Unknown Speaker 22:32
so on. They also entertained the guests a tennis with them

Unknown Speaker 22:41
so after three years you just decided that you wanted to go go into farming. Did you have any background in farming at all?

Unknown Speaker 22:58
No, are we still suit learn? The neighbors were very good when they told him When would you say he grew a lot of potatoes to at that time and and they were very helpful, especially the radicals.

Unknown Speaker 23:15
What other neighbors did you have then? Around there? Well,

Unknown Speaker 23:19
Reynolds We're next door

Unknown Speaker 23:22
right across the lake across fields.

Unknown Speaker 23:25
Let's see. Gavin Reynolds dad was there at the time and he

Unknown Speaker 23:32
I think he helped to build that house. Even a carpenter. Think that was it? Yes. They were our nearest neighbors and then the next ones, I guess were Stewart's across the lake and then McLennan further on and Steven was

Unknown Speaker 23:55
Mr. Pyatt Stevens came after

Unknown Speaker 23:57
my son

Unknown Speaker 24:03
and then Mr. Pyatt who the mailman delivered the mail every day

Unknown Speaker 24:11
with the mail come in to be reappointed.

Unknown Speaker 24:13
He went all the way to be required because he was a store Don't be reappointed that time.

Unknown Speaker 24:18
Is that where you did most of your shopping or would it be in Fulford

Unknown Speaker 24:23
Patterson had historic beaver Find out at 440

Unknown Speaker 24:26
I've never been

Unknown Speaker 24:30
there first Mr. Pie I used to go up to again these to pick up the mail that came in on the old Princess Mary. And the Oh he got there sometimes you have to wait for hours the ship was always late for engine breaking down or something. So he didn't just wait out there until the mail came and then he delivered after that.

Unknown Speaker 24:51
So no fairy way from Bangui here with the prince was married. stopped it

Unknown Speaker 25:00
I like came to again these didn't stop the Gilead

Unknown Speaker 25:05
there was a book before that the lady rose

Unknown Speaker 25:10
no the lady Rose was another one that's the

Unknown Speaker 25:14
quote that came into the report for the lady rose

Unknown Speaker 25:16
yeah but the Joan

Unknown Speaker 25:19
was the Joan there then yeah there she

Unknown Speaker 25:23
was on occasionally yeah yeah

Unknown Speaker 25:29
did you go did you go off island a lot?

Unknown Speaker 25:33
No, just when we had to go we had no jet

Unknown Speaker 25:38
no doubt Thank y'all. Yeah, but every once in a while that I had to go down for a while quite often that

Unknown Speaker 25:45
did you have family still back in? Yes.

Unknown Speaker 25:51
Would you go over would you take the children over just go for by yourself?

Unknown Speaker 25:55
No, usually was the children.

Unknown Speaker 25:58
How long would that take

Unknown Speaker 26:00
to take over so you'd get on the boat when it got into the air?

Unknown Speaker 26:06
You would get on the boat coming back you get on a boat to Vancouver. And of course Stop it all the main pandering galley I don't unload freight. And pick up freight. So you're the Vancouver I think it was nine o'clock in the morning and end up in Salisbury maybe 10 o'clock at night.

Unknown Speaker 26:30
Long day.

Unknown Speaker 26:31
And if you're going the other way, sometimes that's getting into Vancouver.

Unknown Speaker 26:39
But I guess it took a lot less time to get to Victoria.

Unknown Speaker 26:43
Oh, yes.

Unknown Speaker 26:44
Would you go into Sydney

Unknown Speaker 26:47
know what the sidekick was on. By the time we were up here. It traveled the return trip in the morning. And the return trip in the afternoon, late afternoon. And it had to make that that ferry you know dentist appointment or anything like that you just had to make that first ferry so it was an early Stewart

Unknown Speaker 27:14
was was there was there no dentist on the island?

Unknown Speaker 27:19
Not that

Unknown Speaker 27:20
I don't think there was originally

Unknown Speaker 27:23
there were doctors here though or at least this was Dr. Rush here then. That was

Unknown Speaker 27:31
before before 1940 Stop listening was here when we came again with him I think

Unknown Speaker 27:42
it was Dr. Wilkie? No,

Unknown Speaker 27:45
this this is before but

Unknown Speaker 27:48
who is the doctor look after you and you had pneumonia?

Unknown Speaker 27:52
Oh, that was that was Doctor will decide. But that was a lot later when they first came up as a doctor in Ghana Ganges. That all you have to do is get up there and only look after you.

Unknown Speaker 28:10
And then of course the hospital was there. That first lady Minto. Yeah. Did you have your children there and that hospitals

Unknown Speaker 28:16
to children there

Unknown Speaker 28:23
when your children were young? Who would you go to for you had? Who would you go to if you wanted either like advice about your children? Or if you needed, like help in any way? Would you go to your two years? Did you still have your family living with you? Or was it just those first three years that your family was? What do I do help the baby wants to

Unknown Speaker 28:53
know Tom's mother was still up here at that time. But as a rule, there was not you don't seem to have much problem. Many problems, you know, so you could you it was easy to raise children there. Yeah. Because it was a different different age at that time. Like it is now. Yeah, I

Unknown Speaker 29:12
know a lot of women you know, who first came and settled in the prairies and things when they were so isolated. It was so hard for them. Like they had no one like, you know, no one to talk to about the kids. You know how women have a kind of Shop Talk, you know, but it's about their, their children instead. And I'm wondering if you if you had like a community of people that you used to talk to or you used to help look after each other's kids or, or,

Unknown Speaker 29:38
well, we really didn't need help looking after the children because Tom's mother was always willing to babysit, you know, but there was the there was this community hall and that beaver point right next to the school. So when the children were going to school, there's always concerts dances meetings cards I think they had whatever you wanted to join in.

Unknown Speaker 30:09
So there's lots for the children to do there.

Unknown Speaker 30:12
Well yeah all the children would go with the parents so and even the the late night you know, dances that went on into the morning and I don't think we went to those they just put the leather coats out in the cloakroom and just put the children don't talk when it was time for them to go through a lot of noise

Unknown Speaker 30:37
so the children were just kind of play until they got tired and then yeah,

Unknown Speaker 30:41
yeah. And you know there was a lot for children to do at that time the swimming in the lake and you know just wandering around

Unknown Speaker 30:59
so when you were having after you finished having the you know, the resort with doing all the cooking and things did you have did you do work on the farm yourself?

Unknown Speaker 31:08
Does it work? Or did you just play

Unknown Speaker 31:13
what would you do?

Unknown Speaker 31:15
Oh, I even helped him cut down the tree was because cuts running right here. But what else did I Oh, it's a good place to bring up kids had to work.

Unknown Speaker 31:32
What would they do?

Unknown Speaker 31:34
Oh, they do everything. Milk cows. feed the baby. Get in a pickup potato they worked in so they always had to work it out on their own while they knew how to work. Yeah. For all the kids these days.

Unknown Speaker 31:56
That's right. They know how to watch TV. No, but um, did did either one of you have a particular thing that you always did like Could one of you say look after the garden the vegetable garden?

Unknown Speaker 32:07
What did you I think we both did it. Yeah. I could quite a few vegetables at first. Very good tomatoes and onions. But I think you know Tom just put in what he felt should go in and I I put in things that I felt.

Unknown Speaker 32:26
So what else did you grow in the way of vegetable?

Unknown Speaker 32:30
Oh, just it just things to eat. You know, corn pains. Just the usual things.

Unknown Speaker 32:36
Asparagus to grow asparagus.

Unknown Speaker 32:40
And asparagus now?

Unknown Speaker 32:44
And how about fruit?

Unknown Speaker 32:47
Oh, all sorts of apple trees. And while there was a big arch here Oh, no arches.

Unknown Speaker 32:54
More apples me ever use?

Unknown Speaker 32:55
What would you do with them?

Unknown Speaker 32:57
Well, after the resort close, we had a great big dining room there and we pick apples in the fall and it'd be cool for me covered with boxes of apples. Every every morning. No, because if you take a bucket of apples up, put them in their happiness card.

Unknown Speaker 33:18
So you didn't try to sell them then to anyone. No market.

Unknown Speaker 33:24
There hadn't been a market on the island for some years. I don't think apples there's so many

Unknown Speaker 33:29
except for juicing.

Unknown Speaker 33:31
Did somebody on the island tutus Have you said except producing?

Unknown Speaker 33:37
That was just in the last few years? I think we were out here at that. Oh, yes.

Unknown Speaker 33:41
Yeah. No at that time, no.

Unknown Speaker 33:47
So what other kinds of fruit is that Cherries? Cherries? Yes. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 33:53
Royal and beyond the lawn it just spread out as wide as this room. Every one every second year that we just voted with cherries and bird to get half of them it'd be more than you could eat. It was like to smoke up the word to get over

Unknown Speaker 34:15
Did you do a lot of preserving you know jams and did you preserve vegetables? Yes. What would you do with them before you ate

Unknown Speaker 34:29
Tom for one Christmas present he got me this great big pressure cooker. Double pressure cooker in seven jars on the bottom several jars on the top hole. It was the bane of my existence

Unknown Speaker 34:48
years of work

Unknown Speaker 34:53
so you know you can can undo the vegetables in much shorter time. safer they said yeah, I didn't poison anybody.

Unknown Speaker 35:05
Did you preserve meat at all?

Unknown Speaker 35:07
Yes, we did. So about two we don't care for it so much. We're very glad when we finally got the free the freezer in.

Unknown Speaker 35:16
Was that while you were down there with that? No,

Unknown Speaker 35:19
it was still on you're still down here

Unknown Speaker 35:25
so Did did you go to work for anybody else at all? While you had the farm you just

Unknown Speaker 35:30
know just to help out

Unknown Speaker 35:33
to help out like when rock was were crashing great grain or something like that. All the neighbors

Unknown Speaker 35:43
did you have all the farm equipment yourself for running your own farm like oh, did you eat a baler? And no, no, I

Unknown Speaker 35:50
didn't know baler I started out with one horse that I got a tractor later on. Do My Own plowing and this game was going on with Lloyd Reynolds used new custom banning eventually we got to a bell filing

Unknown Speaker 36:16
and when you get other people to come and help you with the work or or have

Unknown Speaker 36:20
no mostly myself or my son when he was old enough.

Unknown Speaker 36:25
We didn't have such a big output you know. Fields and so

Unknown Speaker 36:30
on. How many acres would you did you did you find altogether?

Unknown Speaker 36:36
Well we had 320 But of course a lot of it was just bush to sheep Oh, I guess we had about 1012 acres all together. It was just one night potato a gardening orchard

Unknown Speaker 37:10
I wanted to ask you a little bit about when your children were at school. Where did they go to school?

Unknown Speaker 37:16
Well beaver point first of all the three of them went there until a we got the school bus running

Unknown Speaker 37:26
three miles How long did that take them to walk?

Unknown Speaker 37:29
All depends on what they were doing. Took a long time on the way Oh, yeah. They they got rides very often. Oh, did they you know people driving out to be reporting or coming home from fever point. And one teacher had a car she used to pick up quite a few of them on the way he she looked. Ganges way.

Unknown Speaker 37:51
Oh man. Did you remember who that

Unknown Speaker 37:53
was from Eagles was flawless. Fluffy Eagles did we call her floss? Eagles eagles. And so they've been the rival they don't seem to mind walking away

Unknown Speaker 38:16
so it takes them about an hour I guess there were more did you have when would you send them to school in the morning? Oh,

Unknown Speaker 38:24
but it always would take them a lot in the car and bad weather riding hard or something like that.

Unknown Speaker 38:31
We started a love about eight o'clock. Goodness knows when they got there.

Unknown Speaker 38:35
And then they just come back home taking taking longer what they go up with they usually go with friends or just work what go by themselves. So

Unknown Speaker 38:44
there were usually youngsters going along. And these people that came from from China. They had three triplets. Naturally they were triplets and then an older girl. So they all went while we stayed in the with with us they went up to be reported to school. So there's usually somebody to walk with. And the old girl started out at first course and then the second one would come a couple of years after that. The other woman about a year and a half after that. So

Unknown Speaker 39:24
do I do a lot of that you mentioned that a Chinese family were there a lot of Japanese people going to school with your kids I guess

Unknown Speaker 39:31
no tear no they were they were up again. Geez. When they didn't go to school again. GSD and Mark it's all the more Academy family. We're going to Richie especially the course that was quite a few years later.

Unknown Speaker 39:47
That's right. I guess that was after the Japanese people came back.

Unknown Speaker 39:51
No. They started before they were Yes,

Unknown Speaker 39:58
epic epic. They came into people on the bus stop to Ganges before that do they

Unknown Speaker 40:05
know without us time work the children up there.

Unknown Speaker 40:12
Do you remember what year it was when they when they went up to Ganges? Or do you remember how old your any of your children were there

Unknown Speaker 40:24
was no phone logs up and after all these sets, okay, how old are my children? Oh that's all right. All right. Did you rock out remember notes seemed to be Richie was going to school before they were in turn but no

Unknown Speaker 40:44
I think he was only a baby when they went well it must be when they came back. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 40:48
A few years later.

Unknown Speaker 40:50
That's right. That was in the 50s. I think. So were there any it'd be repoint? There were no Japanese family so or

Unknown Speaker 40:58
not? Our children? We're going, how about the Hawaii?

Unknown Speaker 41:01
Were there any of the kayakers there? Oh, no. I

Unknown Speaker 41:04
think they went to school. Isabella point.

Unknown Speaker 41:06
And how about Indian children?

Unknown Speaker 41:13
Yes, it was one family, the papen burgers to the repoint. And let's see, I know. Two of them went there. At least. There may have been some younger ones that came along afterwards.

Unknown Speaker 41:31
Anyway, the kids all seem to play together. Did they? Oh, yeah. Did you used to when you're you know, when your family was young? Did you used to do a lot of visiting like back and forth different families visiting?

Unknown Speaker 41:45
Well, not a terrific alone. It would be mostly on a Sunday if you know, people might come out or we might go to see them. Because, yes, but during the week, you were usually to visit. I think sometimes the women got away in the weekday afternoons. But

Unknown Speaker 42:05
we've and then you go and visit with your children, maybe when they were small.

Unknown Speaker 42:10
Sometimes Sometimes they'd be at school. No, it was sort of a struggle, or we did go when they were quite young, but it was sort of a struggle getting them all. We took them into Victoria, that was that was enough.

Unknown Speaker 42:27
That's right. What else did you use to do when you when you weren't working? What kinds of things would you do like for fun? When your family was, you know, young?

Unknown Speaker 42:38
Did we have any fun?

Unknown Speaker 42:41
Did you go to Hugo sometimes you'd go over to Victoria. But was that mainly when you had business like the dentist or something?

Unknown Speaker 42:49
Whoever wants the dentist to stay there and the rest of the family went to a movie or something like that. Which was usually the one that was dear. But you know, that showed him a swim. And we used to go swimming every night before after the work was finished. And he would visit they'd be picnics out at Beaver point. Oh,

Unknown Speaker 43:21
did you belong to any organizations like farmers Institute or the IoD II or the Women's Institute or anything before I did for a long time? Maybe can you What would you do? I mean, what did you do? Did you just attend?

Unknown Speaker 43:44
We had executive had meetings every so often and an annual meeting exactly what we did. George Nikki was the like the chairman most of the time the Foreign Service.

Unknown Speaker 44:12
So what you'd have meetings with? Did you have like a membership that would meet every so often? Yeah. How often would you meet

Unknown Speaker 44:20
or the membership only met about once a year?

Unknown Speaker 44:24
And do you remember what kinds of things would be discussed or talked about oh,

Unknown Speaker 44:29
things like artificial insemination, stuff like that. You know, I'm trying to get that in organized which Georgia eventually did viruses on a piece of property guarantees life out there with the old logged up was where that market is now. So they had an income from that I'm various fancy consumer farmers, I guess,

Unknown Speaker 45:03
different machines, maybe in different ways of farming. But they talk about different ways of farming of agriculture. Well, yes.

Unknown Speaker 45:20
knows, I think they used to have a meeting about once a year to debate with somebody coming over from the Agricultural Department and talking about different things like pruning or sheep breeding and you know, different things like that. Today,

Unknown Speaker 45:38
I think the pharmacist was instrumental in getting inspectors in for seed inspectors like we grew foundation potato seed at one time, rapids did the same thing you have on the Senate inspector over there, check your field, and well road them take on any disease plans, and so on. And if you have to pass inspection, then you've got the certification. You can sell your data set a seat. Foundation seats, I think was the biggest, top class certified females.

Unknown Speaker 46:24
Did you in those days when you were farming? Did you find that the government had very much to do with your life? Your work as farming? Was there you sold your cream to the creamery? Was there any kind of, you know, any kind of government bureaucracy that went on about the cows? No, I

Unknown Speaker 46:44
don't think oh, well, there was they didn't they were tested.

Unknown Speaker 46:50
testing was done when we started. The best we had testing for that come around test.

Unknown Speaker 47:04
Done next door is all over BC. Right.

Unknown Speaker 47:20
Now, so can you didn't belong to any of the women's organizations? So the women's the sunshine guild, Or? Or?

Unknown Speaker 47:28
No, Tom's mother belong to the Women's Institute? That was done in the fall frequent Women's Institute? What would she do? Oh, they used to have meetings fairly often. Go of t. And I think they did quite a bit. The I think the they financed one of the hospital rooms and the meeting mento and, ah, different works like that, you know, they probably put on sales and teas and things and I can't remember all the things that she really enjoyed going to the meeting the people say, Did you

Unknown Speaker 48:22
back especially back in the 40s? Do you remember? Do you remember? Like any serious social problems? Like were there families? You know, during the war, a lot of people must have been widowed. And with Did you were you aware of any kind of problems, say with poverty or? or anything like that? Well, at

Unknown Speaker 48:45
the time, we came up in 1940 it was I think the depression was still on here, anyway. And a lot of people were just poor but you know, they live off the land. And I think in the cities, I think they had to had to do something for the the people there, you know, what did they do? They put in road and trail building I think a lot here on the island. No, not here. No, as far as I can see, people just looked after themselves. And I suppose if anybody knew of a family that was really suffering, they would help them because I think most of the people were really helpful

Unknown Speaker 49:35
you know. So what they've maybe share some if they had extra crap food or vegetables they take for anybody

Unknown Speaker 49:41
to pay your taxes, you can work it out on the road.

Unknown Speaker 49:47
How would that how would that be? Would you Would they just approach you and say here you can get work your taxes off, or would you call them up? I

Unknown Speaker 49:54
couldn't pay

Unknown Speaker 49:56
for a job and I would do the work long enough to pay your taxes. Have you paid your taxes?

Unknown Speaker 50:06
So there were I guess people would just then help each other out basically.

Unknown Speaker 50:10

Unknown Speaker 50:14
And there was no I haven't. Well, were you aware of any kind of crime or anything of that sort on the on the island has any

Unknown Speaker 50:26
when we go into Victoria, that marcadores? Nothing ever.

Unknown Speaker 50:35
Yeah. And I suppose there was the usual family troubles and in certain spots, you know, but no, you you wouldn't worry about going on at night at all.

Unknown Speaker 50:52
Well, what about if within families, you know, there was something, you know, wrong in the families like people getting? I mean, did you Was there any of that going on? Like,

Unknown Speaker 51:03
well, there was a policeman of the Ganges. What was his name? Despite that he would handle I mean, I imagine anything like that. But you didn't hear too much trouble, and it

Unknown Speaker 51:23
was just considered personal, people's own business.

Unknown Speaker 51:28
I think so. But I also think that neighbors would be very helpful. You know, they knew any family was in trouble. They wants to go help. Yeah. Now, I just

Unknown Speaker 51:44
had a couple of months you were mentioning when you first came to the island in the 40s. You were mentioning something about Mr. Bullock. Yes. Ted, you? Did you know him at all. I think he died at 40. I remember

Unknown Speaker 51:57
no, but I was a lot of stories about I was up in the hospital one time and Ruby West was there at that time, she was a schoolteacher. And she'd been on the island for quite a while. So she used to tell me tales of Mr. Bullock just the dinners he gave them. And the young girls if they would wear gloves white, I think it was usually white gloves. He would usually get a pair of earrings to where they hadn't had the ears pierced and these earrings and she used to say it was never quite like she he was very much a character I believe on the island. He must have gone shortly after we we came here.

Unknown Speaker 52:54
Yeah. Yeah, I think so. He wasn't well I think for the last few years and he died in 48 I think or 48 Yeah. So what was what was Fulford like when you first came to the island

Unknown Speaker 53:14
there were two stores down there. Addison sound good most cover? kitty corner cover where the Cafe is now?

Unknown Speaker 53:35
Did they sell the same stuff

Unknown Speaker 53:45
so how would people decide where to shop?

Unknown Speaker 53:49
I don't know just started with one I guess and then the customer go back to the same one I guess. I think we shot mostly in Patterson's.

Unknown Speaker 54:03
Yes. I can remember what it was to cut. You know, when the war started and the rationing came in. The first time I went down and I said well, I've got a coupon here. I want to buy some tea. So he he said all rationing hasn't started yet. So he put his hand

Unknown Speaker 54:36
up and come to Salt Spring

Unknown Speaker 54:42
Oh, I guess there was a lot of that what?

Unknown Speaker 54:48
What, what other changes were there when the war was on here? I guess you came here the war was had just started. Did you have blackouts here? Yes, we

Unknown Speaker 54:58
do. Yes. Yeah. The time yeah

Unknown Speaker 55:02
but it seemed very far away it was closer we were down in Vancouver I think because there's so many more people going off coming back but he hasn't ever blackouts I don't think we needed blackouts we only had coal oil and gas lamps but then they were worried about the Japanese too coming to the coast getting him

Unknown Speaker 55:32
were people very upset about that at the time.

Unknown Speaker 55:35
I think that's hard to tell some of them were upset like the the neuro academies were they were a wonderful wonderful family and I think when they just tend to pick up and go leave everything there lots of people thought it was a terrible thing

Unknown Speaker 56:00
yeah I guess people just didn't know what to expect

Unknown Speaker 56:08
Well, I think that was it there was such a scare came on about the Japanese they've been found something floating in or somebody saw submarines or you know the West Coast they seem closer here

Unknown Speaker 56:30
but it was a terrible thing.

Unknown Speaker 56:34
When the war ended did was there any Did you could you notice a big change on the island were there a lot of people returning to the island or was it still fairly small numbers?

Unknown Speaker 56:44
No it was still fairly small some of the returned and some didn't know it was still really much the way that it was before wasn't it?

Unknown Speaker 57:01
Did things improve economically here you said when you got here in 1940 people were still pretty poor did things pick up after during or after the war?

Unknown Speaker 57:11
Oh I suppose they did you know was logging things like that. A lot of people were into logging on the island at that time. I imagined they got more for their logs at that time. We didn't we did

Unknown Speaker 57:27
our places logged in I think we were getting $1 without really stopping we had several million feet of rocket

Unknown Speaker 57:42
so did you log it yourself?

Unknown Speaker 57:47
Made a stoppage

Unknown Speaker 57:51
Did you ever do any logging on the island or work in that area at all? Just kept busy just ask you a little bit about Ganges Ganges has seen a lot of changes since since you first came. What was it like when you first came in? 1940? Oh

Unknown Speaker 58:18
no. Just launch general store. First game they

Unknown Speaker 58:24
had a hotel there, didn't they? Yes. Next hotel

Unknown Speaker 58:28
next article. It's there.

Unknown Speaker 58:32
To remember what it was called? Sip mullets? Was it just called mo it's

Unknown Speaker 58:37
motivating coming up.

Unknown Speaker 58:42
And then lay in Miss Turner had a little obser dragon start where you can go off and buy anything. Just a wonderful little place. Where was it? Oh, the boat. drugstores wasn't? No they moved over there later on after after Nora took it over. It was on the other side, the water side out over the water. Round or the was the cafe there? And that second one did just about over that way. And it was up on stilts that women you know because I think the tide came in at times. But she had just a small store but it was just amazing. Something like Patterson's down at Fulford, if you ask them if they had anything, they could usually find that they'd go in and poke about in the back, you know and usually come out with what you wanted that she was Nora krupinski Mother. I think her husband must have gone on the war and Insurance died shortly after the war.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:05
So the post office was in Ghent there was a post office in Ganges two. Oh, there must have been Yes. I don't remember that. Do you remember where it was? No, no,

Unknown Speaker 1:00:16
we didn't have what to do with Ganges at that time.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:21
Except for mullets,

Unknown Speaker 1:00:22
they suffer more.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:26
You can buy anything out there to actually or they get it for you, you know?

Unknown Speaker 1:00:31
And the theory came in there then Is there anything else that you that you want to that you remember about the end and

Unknown Speaker 1:00:46
you're going to condense all this. I'm sure it shouldn't be edited. Not at all. Thank you.