Salt Spring Island Archives
| Accession Number | |||
| Date | August 2020 | ||
| Media | digital recording | Audio | mp3 √ |
| duration | 43 |
440_Nancy-Wigen_Marshall-Martin-Arnett_Family-History_First-Nations_08-2020.mp3
otter.ai
12.02.2024
no
Outline
Unknown Speaker 0:00
Your words down, Pat.
Unknown Speaker 0:01
I guess. Oh,
Speaker 1 0:02
that the alright. Yeah. So if you just state your name Nancy and where we're at
Speaker 2 0:09
Nancy Reagan. At would on? Oh
Speaker 1 0:18
that's good. Okay, thank you and that's what is the date? August
Speaker 3 0:22
5 2020. Right 2020 Okay, thank you. Just gonna want to come closer.
Speaker 1 0:31
I'm just gonna move this. You know what? I can put it on a bucket? Yeah, I just want to make sure I have this done. Okay. That's good. Okay. All right. So thanks for meeting with us, Nancy. We really appreciate it.
Unknown Speaker 0:46
Well, it's nice
Speaker 2 1:01
very well, with you. You know? Yeah, he was. He was oh, good at doing s having historical meetings. Yeah. Yeah. So what did you want? Oh, well, I'll
Speaker 1 1:28
just remind you just a little bit I think I said on the phone about how we're involved all of us are involved in a couple of other people with having an interpretive panel put in down here at Fernwood, right, cross the road kitty corner from your house that's going to speak about more specifically the Panella cut people and their relationship to this land and and people that are still living here. And settlers such as yourself who were here. When first nations were coming, of course, they've been here for 1000s of years before us, but what your experience might have been when your family maybe you could start by telling us how your family came to Saltspring. And
Speaker 2 2:09
my parents are both actually born in India and came to Canada. Separately, in their teens met in my dad worked for the Hudson's Bay Company. And my mother II came to pick us up like bad health content, rheumatic fever, and England. What's killing him? Oh they, my parents moved boots on spring night 22. Came to for wood worth which was bigger in those days. It was big enough for cars to drive out on it. And they had a lot of harm. You're next to a spa?
Unknown Speaker 3:26
Yes. Yeah. Beautiful area up
Speaker 2 3:29
there. Yes. So the PEEP Oh, we all did Cooper island in those days. They had a path way through or farm because they had run it up on North Beach or north and and people who were mixed race and so weeks cage Li Er, oh was very respectful in her left and gates. or disturb me animals at all. Which as a farmer you appreciate.
Unknown Speaker 4:37
And when I was I guess my first money I earned was stinky clams. And most you're burnt Hudson's point. Which is good gravel and
Speaker 2 5:07
big Pete. The buyer fish buyer would come by ACE and pick up its x clams we put in apps X. We dug and night on winter tides are low at night with light lantern light and it was a neighbor or Doris e Greenough. Who was a couple years older than I was and she was taking a look art can't act and act with the people. Oh was brand and great women and children used to come not look good. If it's urgent Aries my parents made every arm it was oh, Aries but rest Aries and the beep like very mom was always happy is because most pick your own state the best and leave her rest. See? First h and k are kids and a right. Kids pick the berries and leaves. Yeah. And would make tea. She ate to be bought in but they would never come into the house. Like just sit on a blanket outside. So she'd bring out tea in scones and juice for the day. Carry Jews. Yeah. And yeah. And they didn't all speak English and of course didn't speak their language. Mom had come from well, more urban air is from first of all farmers on the coast. Your shirts. I am it's infant and Prince Albert sketch. So it was lonely here. She would have liked to think and but but they weren't open to that. It was one woman eat
Speaker 2 8:36
rice would it be Mary? Oh her first name. Brent's ears. Oh, in the butt hurt not hers was during the war. That was I was born in 1930 or so. But child 40 sporty 30s 40s and the Air Force used to train in this area. And it was a plane it went out when it's right and who's on it actually. We're on their way to our face. Alright, thanks. Reed Island and not IQ for the plane crashed it's a and hurt, said we should close if there's any money survived and she boots up Straight to air but he urged her and there were two men who came up from aid and Mr. Rice and we're just gonna take them in the end good hold on to the
Unknown Speaker 10:32
or oh my goodness what a story
Speaker 2 10:35
yeah and they you know there's oh wait oh H is appears to one of the white peach is thank you to our firm and told us what happened and so we went in and got one of it's pretty started to walk out
Unknown Speaker 11:12
yeah that's incredible
Unknown Speaker 11:15
Yeah
Speaker 1 11:18
certainly so would that have been the early 40s Do
Unknown Speaker 11:22
you think yeah was in the 40s
Unknown Speaker 11:24
that would be written up
Unknown Speaker 11:29
yeah no drift okay Sydney review me yeah
Unknown Speaker 11:34
yeah
Unknown Speaker 11:38
yeah so a bit of French what
Speaker 4 11:49
are the thoughts and once she gives me a drug use you talked about people being mixed race was was Mrs. rice mixed race
Speaker 2 12:07
the women used to fish first springs out men in those goose coasters or they people are sad to hear for ever. And oh, thank you the seas and the okay times and that itch and they get those big oak that would come in and I remember we went week older in our boat we went to call your best or or Inc man in oh it was a 12 foot suit shoot fish with a shorthand line right the kelp is small herring. Here is fine. What's h e b Let's eat and he was catching gross every time he EC N E every time
Speaker 2 14:02
Yeah. Well, we had your co host Ross Perot problem IE. The well did come out of the OCE and end of Erie streams on the east coast of Vancouver Island into this ilish II in early summer. And the E here and l fall or winter and certainly some of them went hurt. And it was a part of that effort went out into its into her life here. And out night in If EDF Oh, oh mass of earth every fish free and verts in ears and thing are lights as first you could see in actions they've finished lights all night Vancouver city carrying a script this is great Oh and yes it did 45 routes and their catch was immatures is
Speaker 4 15:52
that it was a herring reduction plant as Steve said when the when the salmon fishery collapsed the they turned it into a reduction plan for for for herring just to make oil and fertilizer.
Unknown Speaker 16:05
I know what a tragedy
Speaker 4 16:09
until until it was gone till the herring was it's a tragedy
Speaker 2 16:17
the people the native all plant for
Speaker 2 16:31
Earth they just oh I'm Harry was one more than anything else. What's theirs? Oh really? Yeah. And you know for years oh it was nice but now it digs up on the coast or herring boats and they depended on us hurry and
Unknown Speaker 17:25
and we we finish with carbon metal spoons and with our robe oat and later it's import Briggs and Stratton. Oh yeah. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 17:48
that was a great old engine. Yeah.
Speaker 2 17:51
But that was an important part of our food. But after that, that's it in fish. The fish up the air. And since then, there is an E for the herring to rebuild, generate every time. There's there. Looks like a few herring. There. It's opening air cut. Well, the fish faces distract us to eat five or six popular ends if parents lived on the outer coast between Washington and Alaska, it would come into English Aegis. Some of those runs are miles across just as all fish for miles.
Unknown Speaker 19:05
So you saw that yourself?
Speaker 2 19:07
Well, not those big, big us. We didn't go very far in our but all was herring and the ghost but and you know kids eat is Oh, US dogs would drive. Herring. It's your it goes game and freeze. And there are pork butts and seals. Not California is which is our males only because else but those herring runs are just right then seal would come
Unknown Speaker 20:04
into its waters and they were destroyed by the fish I mean this is nuts if I if I can kill 20% if 20% of my chickens is Emerald
Speaker 3 20:35
well it assumes they know how many they're starting with which they don't know what was wrong they're always
Speaker 4 20:46
making their decisions from their offices they're not they don't have people on the water shifting
Unknown Speaker 20:52
baseline
Unknown Speaker 20:56
you know they cut workers the people actually nice
Unknown Speaker 21:15
wife
Speaker 4 21:17
Yes. Did you ever see the runs in Ganges harbour because they were doing signage for Ganges as well. And that's what we're being told is what was so important as Ganges was the herring
Speaker 2 21:31
that was huge. What do you do? There are a ton it's out of catch. But
Unknown Speaker 21:46
is that big too? Yeah.
Speaker 2 21:48
And I had one publication that got lost somehow we record seabirds at work. And so spring with hearing the word birds work and yours screams you know, not just goals and it won't be native peoples just look at us first Earth there went Earth on earth can you patch
Speaker 3 22:41
amazing Did you ever do you? Do you recall them ever using nets for hunting season seabirds or ducks?
Speaker 2 22:50
No. Those were not oh it was not. I was here. Yeah. We used it right grant ECE in winter state come for the IDs and their large box of scold errs and you know now it's 10 e scooters and not winter and the occasional haven't it's a great three years the creams come usually read or yeah
Speaker 1 23:44
Was there a particular beach here now see that the herring would come to despond or
Speaker 2 23:50
wherever there's no press okay there's no grass on here and for a while there was a native people use Harrington but it would put cedar wrench it's in water or it's flattening X Well Eric F is on it just take the benches out. Strip eggs
Speaker 4 24:33
would say we will do see that from from where you were living up the road to like look out and see canoes doing that like like harvesting the row?
Speaker 2 24:45
No, they would. And ease and Swan word, Harry spawned or leave them here and The roots in the Harry hatch out are in middle school. It's still schools time. Like this days, you know, is when it's calm or use S Oh
Speaker 1 25:31
yeah. Can I just I just want to backup to a question from earlier when you said the people would come from Panella to visit their relatives. Yeah. And come through a path on your farm. So where would they where would they put their they would have their canoes and their leaves their canoes? Were just sort of in front of where your house was
Speaker 2 25:50
there just beach. Okay, because that was a closer place
Speaker 1 25:53
and then they would want and would it be the Sampson's that they would be visiting would
Unknown Speaker 25:57
you presume? No. Right and and cantos
Unknown Speaker 26:04
okay and like okay,
Speaker 1 26:12
I don't know the Ryan name where were they
Unknown Speaker 26:15
was Jimmy Ryan and yeah up north end road it was we're right and the candles and what was
Speaker 2 26:43
yeah was bearish is yeah my two cottage is on our E when was three rooms and one which just went through and they had him because it's it's well water an outhouse gets amps and what's dope so it's wood fire wood and
Speaker 2 27:36
we lived on earth for often on be yours and was live in the green room caught there was serious drinking they the first wave left drinking and this was mixed grace that's quite was pure First Nation
Speaker 2 28:37
yeah but their drinking was serious and one party last it is it knife fight might leave the garbage is for rent for $5 but
Speaker 1 29:11
those prices you don't want to break any rule was this a McFadden saw that you were speaking of that? That that would happen with
Speaker 2 29:19
I can't or I know well it was older man Oh was the young man and I heard that he actually was too and took his own life insurance
Speaker 1 29:49
sad ending. Yeah, I have another question that I'm sorry but I'm gonna have to go but I could leave the recorder. Just just a backup about Mary rice and your mother's friendship. Mary was I think known as a quite a healer, in First Nations cultural practices. Do you know if your mother and her had any if their friendship was based at all on plants or from her
Speaker 2 30:17
credit, herbs, but these weren't native herbs with an odd each or goals airy? I'm not sure I think I can't remember or us use thing. The native okay, but read it herbs with the Watkins man.
Unknown Speaker 30:51
Watkins man. Yes,
Speaker 2 30:53
it was it was fresh. Who had been Ella? And pepper and cinnamon? And not? And
Speaker 4 31:09
very valuable. Yes more valuable things.
Speaker 2 31:13
Yes. And my other crews time and save three and h and orange party are always clay or Shale Hills. It's dry and sunny and herbs at really good and smooched you would try it every school in any state Yes. You know this, but sage or whatever what
Speaker 1 32:03
a great barter system that was. Yeah, get a photo while you're talking wonderful.
Speaker 3 32:09
Nancy, there's a large circle of rocks almost at the end of Malla view kind of where the mailboxes aren't as a huge big circle and they're into two rows. And I don't know if you can keep ever seen that or if you know.
Speaker 2 32:28
Oh, once air dude. Oh. rocks out in front of our face. Yeah. Be like, at a sparrow Ight. Yeah, it's water, but not much of a round off. Maybe six or eight feet high.
Speaker 3 32:54
Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I wondered, there's definitely there's meant several structures along this beach that have been there my lifetime now. I was born in 1972. Just down in the cabin. That's not there anymore on Walker hook road. And I really, you know, I've walked past these structures all of my life, but have only recently started to think about what they were. Yeah. And who might have put them there. Yeah.
Speaker 2 33:22
So, but these books are space to read. So expert groups dope. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 33:33
And so those rocks are on the on the left side of the dock. Kind of, or on the north. Okay. Okay. So heading up towards Hudson's point. Yeah. Yeah. Wonderful.
Speaker 4 33:50
Just the one question I had is, we heard that there was another name for Hudson point. An older name, you
Unknown Speaker 33:58
know, you don't know.
Speaker 1 34:01
What was the name though? We'd heard. We don't know where it was applied to. But there was something like an Indian
Speaker 2 34:10
from point A, the stream came out. We're gonna take off. Okay. Okay. So we're just about,
Unknown Speaker 34:25
we think we're just about done. So hi.
Unknown Speaker 34:30
Corinne, the kids heading out to? Yeah. And we're gonna have dinner instance tomorrow night after Bill. Okay. Okay. Yes.
Speaker 4 34:43
Great. So you were just saying there's a creek that comes down to Hudson's point where you're going to say about the creek.
Speaker 2 34:52
It's coming from the
Unknown Speaker 34:57
Salt Spring because it's Salt Spring
Speaker 2 35:03
And of course it's not all sponsoring North here so it's getting great but yeah like Oakland limit springs that you're like seeps and I think it was part of went for wind farms great fun where boundaries words yeah old age or in property it was it was George Ellis son what is his second what's pros which mother's thought was Garnet Garnet yeah she's
Unknown Speaker 36:23
memorable Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 36:29
So the creek does come down to Hudson from
Speaker 4 36:31
from the Salt Spring we we were talking to Ken Sampson last week and and we were asking we had been told by by some of the Panella cut that there was a time when there was they would bring their canoes from from St Mary Lake across and come out at some point like not not paddling obviously but dragging them and so I just had you ever heard of anything good huge Marsh down by grams road you mean?
Unknown Speaker 37:06
I mean, next to and fro goes
Speaker 4 37:11
along? Like crosses over North and road? Doesn't that big Marsh? Yeah. Does that connect anything to the well go? Yes. But would that come out at Hudson point in your urine?
Unknown Speaker 37:26
Oh, no. No,
Speaker 4 37:27
I know. I'm looking at I look at different maps but you know, like the CRD and islands CEFS have they have Creek maps but they don't seem to be accurate sometimes.
Unknown Speaker 37:38
Ask Kathy. Right.
Speaker 4 37:41
Yeah, yeah. About McFadden Creek. McFadden. creek goes way along there. Yeah.
Speaker 2 37:48
Two streams that came through. Or far. One was fresh water up here. What's read? It was coming from Marsh red color. Yeah. Somehow Oh, it was brackish mineral. Water. Yeah. So but there's trout in looks great. Greek sea run cutthroat and probably re entry use by and Drupal.
Speaker 2 38:40
People have got cut off good work. Or credit? Resilient. Hence the name. Yeah. Yeah. That we're Oh, fish. Creek bird with our face because it dried up in the summer. Yeah, too much clearer. upstream? Yes.
Speaker 1 39:12
Do you do you sort in Trump? Do you have any maps of your property as it was when you were a child? No. If we if we had a map to show you would you be able to sort of map it out for us make the lat the boundary lines if we gave you sort of a present map? Or if I found an old map from the archives maybe yeah, be interesting to see.
Unknown Speaker 39:35
And if any photographs
Speaker 2 39:38
not it's not so many you know? Yeah. It's beautiful. afford
Speaker 4 39:54
to just wind up now, but it sounds like you've got much more to share. Yeah, Wonderful to speak with you
Speaker 3 40:00
I could sit and listen to you all day Netsy it's just so wonderful to hear your stories and just to get your Yeah, just rich so rich.
Speaker 2 40:13
So happy to be able to do this is sort of you know,
Speaker 1 40:24
that's right. Have you written any much of your reminiscence down at all? No
Speaker 2 40:30
not not repeat it's oh
Speaker 1 40:44
you're not alone well I wonder if we should perhaps arrange to do another maybe you could give some thought to other things. I mean, we came with a specific questions in mind and we've gotten off in attendance which are great and and so you know, Rich has terracing, but I wonder if we could maybe if you could give some thought to what else you think you might like to share? And maybe we could do another interview with you and
Speaker 2 41:11
helps get in with other people because things
Speaker 2 41:28
are no. Oops. He's lying. Cheat. Oh. And he's better. I have me six years old. Good.
Speaker 1 41:42
That's impressive. Does he come over at all still now it's here.
Speaker 2 41:46
No, he's an or. Or well, it was here last fall Yes. But
Speaker 1 42:01
maybe not getting together too much because of COVID Right now I'm not sure but if you if you find that he is coming over maybe that could be something we could arrange to talk to both of you Yes. Yeah. Or we could go we could go visit him if he was interested in doing that amenable to that
Unknown Speaker 42:25
Yeah. Oh. Okay. All right. It's
Unknown Speaker 42:40
out there likes to go into practice with his friends at
Speaker 1 42:52
eight so nice. So he's out and about. I have to scoot Would you guys mind if you guys talk back.
Unknown Speaker 43:00
And Chris can
