Salt Spring Island Archives

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Salt Spring in World War One

Chris Arnett, 2018

Accession Number
Date 2018
Media digital recording Audio mp3 √
duration 61

385_Chris-Arnett_Grandfather-WW1_SSI-in-War_War-Memorial_2018.mp

otter.ai

12.02.2024

no

Outline

    WWI contributions and personal stories from Saltspring Island.
  • Chris begins by acknowledging the 100th anniversary of the end of World War One and reflecting on the idealism of the time.
  • Chris shares stories of Saltspring Island veterans and their contributions to the war, highlighting the diverse backgrounds and experiences of those who served.
    WWI enlistment rates in British Columbia.
  • Speaker 1 highlights the high enrollment rate of single men from British ancestry in the Gulf Islands, particularly those given remittances from wealthy families in England.
  • The speaker notes that these men were the first to join up for the war effort, despite being young and single, and commemorates their sacrifice on the honor roll.
  • Thomas Anderson, a Vancouver fireman, served 40 years and fought every major fire in Vancouver from 1920 to 1953, including the Great Fire of 1886.
  • Anderson retired in 1955 with 132 years of service and was Vancouver's longest-serving fireman in history.
    WWI veteran's experiences and research methods.
  • Speaker 1 discusses their grandfather's experience in World War One, sharing that he never talked about the war despite being a highly accomplished man.
  • The speaker researches their grandfather's military history using institutions such as the Canadian Great War Project and receives a 50-page package of information charting his journey through the war.
  • The speaker visited the Royal Westminster Regiment Armory in New Westminster, BC, where they found valuable information about their grandfather's service in World War One, including his original war diary and other archival sources.
  • Using these sources, the speaker was able to piece together some of their grandfather's story during the war, including his service with the 47th Canadian Infantry Battalion and his experiences during the fighting on Hill 70.
  • Speaker 1 shares stories about their grandfather's life in Vancouver, including his birthplace and career as a fireman, as well as his service in the militia during World War I.
  • Speaker 1's grandfather joined the 6 BC Regiment Dooku Konatsu at the age of 17 and served in the 18 Field Ambulance, where he was interested in first aid and stuff.
    Family history and World War I.
  • My granddad, aged 20, enlisted in the Duke of Connaught's Own Rifles in March 1916, just before the regiment was deployed overseas.
  • The regiment trained in Vernon, BC, and had its own uniforms, badges, and spirit decorations, reflecting its unique identity as a Vancouver-based unit.
  • Speaker discusses family photos from 1916, showing grandfather and great-uncle enlisting in the Canadian Expeditionary Force during World War I.
  • Speaker highlights the excitement and camaraderie among soldiers in training camp, as seen in photos of them goofing around and wearing different uniforms.
    WWI soldier's journey from training to front lines.
  • Speaker discusses their ancestor's experience in World War I, including his transfer to the Canadian Reserve Battalion and eventual deployment to France.
  • The speaker highlights the challenges faced by their ancestor and other soldiers during training and in the field, including casualties and demotions.
    WWI battle of Vimy Ridge and Hill 70.
  • My granddad, a member of the 40 sevens battalion New Westminster Fusiliers, fought in the Battle of Vimy Ridge in 1917.
  • The Canadian Corps was involved in an action to divert German troops from the main theater in Flanders, leading to the third battle of Flanders and the Canadian's involvement in the battle of lands.
  • Speaker discusses their grandfather's involvement in the Battle of Hill 70 during World War I, including the challenges of fighting in urban terrain and the significance of the battle for the Canadian Corps.
  • The speaker highlights the book "Capturing Hill 70: The Forgotten Battle in the First World War" by historian Desmond Morton, which provides an in-depth study of the battle and its forgotten status.
    World War I battle tactics and casualties.
  • General Sir Edmund Allenby's creeping barrage strategy successfully took Hill 70 from the Germans, resulting in 5000 Canadian casualties and 20,000 German casualties.
  • Despite the victory, the Germans still held the city of Lens, and General Curry ordered another attack on August 21st, which was also unsuccessful.
  • Speaker describes the challenges of urban warfare during the Battle of Monte Cassino in Italy, including hand-to-hand combat and the difficulty of taking prisoners.
  • The speaker's grandfather's unit, the 47th Canadian Infantry Brigade, was involved in the attack on the suburbs of CTA, where they faced intense machine gun fire and had to fight through ruins and rubble.
    WWI battle and soldier's bravery.
  • Philip Cornwall, a Ukrainian immigrant to Canada, was a bayonet instructor in the Russian army before joining the 40th Canadian Battalion.
  • Corporal Cornwall accounted for 20 of the enemy and led his section in mopping up cellars, craters, and machine gun emplacements, earning him a Victoria Cross citation.
  • Speaker 1 describes the Battle of Hill 70, where the Canadian army fought against the Germans and suffered heavy casualties, including the speaker's grandfather.
  • The speaker's grandfather was wounded in the battle and appears in archival materials, including a war diary and a list of wounded soldiers.
    WWI medical practices and family history.
  • Granddad was treated by American medics in a rural French hospital after Battle of Amiens.
  • Speaker 1's brother was wounded in September and evacuated to England, where he recovered and became a physical education instructor.
    WWI history and personal experiences.
  • Granddad returns home after WWI, reflecting on 420,000 Canadian soldiers who served overseas.
  • Speaker reflects on their grandfather's experiences in World War I, including his service in the 47th Battalion and the vicious fighting in Milan.
  • The speaker's grandfather survived the war and went on to have a successful career as a fire chief in Vancouver.
    WWII veterans' experiences and memories.
  • Grandfather's WWII experience left emotional scar, but he never spoke about it.
  • Speaker 1 discusses a new monument erected to commemorate Hill 70, while Speaker 4 shares stories about their grandfather's involvement in the fire service.
    Family history and war records.
  • Speaker 1 discusses their grandfather's military service in World War II, including his death in action and the impact on the family.
  • Speakers discuss family history and genealogy, sharing stories and photos.

Unknown Speaker 0:00
Welcome to our meeting note afternoon.

Speaker 1 0:13
And they'll display at the top here is people from salt Frank, who actually served in World War One, some came back, some did not. But the family names are missing. Today, Chris is going to talk to us on this grand jury. So Chris, I'll turn it over to you.

Unknown Speaker 0:36
Okay.

Speaker 2 0:42
Thank you, Bob. And thank you all for coming out veterans, ladies and gentlemen. On this really auspicious day, marking the 100th anniversary of the end of World War One, which, knowing my granddad and his friends, you know, I grew up with them, and they always referred to as war to end all wars, which is something, you know, blood people that go into wars these days, I don't think they think that way. But back then, you know, they were very idealistic about it. And sometimes this phrase has been, you know, thought of, to be too idealistic. But I think it was very prescient, because I think World War One was, indeed the war that began the war to end all wars. So talk a bit about that in the end, because there's some stats that actually go to show it even though we look around the world today, there's a lot of conflict, a lot of it is sort of internal conflict within nations. There's very few instances of nation to nation conflict, following World War Two. And when you think about World War One and World War Two, they're really one long war that happened before things got resolved that way. But anyway, today, I'll talk a bit about the Saltspring. contribution to World War One, the archives, we've done a lot of research on the veterans, some of it is here on display, and there's a lot more to be done. Because we had high enrollments here. And a lot of interesting stories, of course, every veteran I that's what I want you to take away from this talk, you know, every every individual served in this war, you know, had a story of background and some, you know, that's where their story ended. But others continued on, and I was one of the lucky ones. My granddad continued on, so that I could be here today. And he went on to an illustrious career in Vancouver as Assistant Fire Chief, and Vancouver's longest serving fireman. But anyway, yeah, let's get on with it. And feel free to interrupt me at any time. So yeah, this is the book by HG Wells, who is, you know, science sort of fiction writer predicted a lot of modern things the world would see. And he was convinced that World War One, I think this came out 1914, it'd be the war to end all wars, you know, we're at a point in civilization where, you know, this is attainable, maybe. And so this, I think, inspired a lot of young men, especially in Canada to enlist with this belief. So here's a photograph of the the honor roll that toured around the Gulf Islands, and in the winter in the fall of 1917. And by 1917, people are getting really war weary, no high casualty rates, the newspapers actually kind of hid the casualty rates a bit, but people had an idea that, you know, it's very dangerous place to be the Western Front. But anyway, over the course of the war, British Columbia had the highest per capita volunteer rate in Canada, which is pretty interesting, 90 per 1000 as compared to Ontario, 75 per 1000, maritimes, 54,000, and Quebec 23 for 1000. But then you look at the enrollments in the Gulf Islands, they actually surpassed the DC stat 140 per 1000. So amazing contribution from the Gulf Island community. And these men are commemorated on this honor roll the tour around the Gulf Islands and then was set up in where the traffic field traffic triangle used to be and remain there for a number of years until till it was replaced with the present day Cenotaph. This is not a Cenotaph. This was something else that list of every man who enrolled in the Gulf Islands and and you can see the ones that have a little.by their names. Those were casualties.

Unknown Speaker 4:41
Any thoughts? Why would the large

Speaker 2 4:45
Oh yeah. Thank you. That's a good question. It you know, part of it was patriotism. But a lot of it was. There's just a lot of single men here. Especially British ancestry. We all know the stories of the remittance man who they've done Saltspring you know, but they were. They were young men who came here and they were men of means they were given remittances from wealthy families in England in the British Isles, but as soon as the war started, and we've done a study of the enrolment rates, they were the first ones to join up. People like Churchill, whose name is on here. We all know that Churchill wrote Churchill beach. He was a distant relative of Winston Churchill is now right. I mean, Churchill, how many Churchill but and one of them was killed left Tennant. Churchill died enact killed in action. But his brother survived. But I don't know if they returned to Saltspring. But they're commemorated in the road in the beach, that we all know. So well. So yeah, there are a lot of men, single men in BC. And the western provinces in general, even though the western provinces had a quarter of Canada's population, they contributed 50% of the infantry to the the effort. But the 90 percentile, I mean, is huge. But Vancouver, where I'm from, originally and fourth generation, thank you, great. Vancouver had the highest per capita enrollment of any city in North America. Because according to Pierre Burton anyway, who wrote a great book on me, and this is the candy street armory, which is still here, it's sort of the headquarters of the BC regiment, which is the the oldest, the sixth BC regiment, the oldest military unit in Vancouver, formed in 1888. And my grandfather joined the active militia in that unit. And I'll talk a bit about that. But anyway, opposite the camera so you can still see it today. This is a parade ground that was used for many, many years. And it was used as a campground during the enlistment of volunteers for the the 158 overseas battalion. So there was my granddad just before his retirement in 1955. And his name is Thomas Anderson. He was born of Norwegian immigrants. Born at 95, my great grandparents came to Vancouver at 1887, just a few months after the great fire, so they had nothing to do with that. And they settled down in what is no Chinatown area, but this was when he was fired chief. This is a newspaper article when you retire, they call them the jumping fireman because every year the peony he would jump from a tall like a five storey platform onto a what do you call it a trampoline. And of course, this is very important in the fire departments in especially in urban cities. You know, a lot of people like to jump from roofs. They had ladder trucks and things with the ladders often weren't high enough. So people had to leap from way up and be caught in this trampoline. Here's my granddad later, he served 40 years. As far as I know, he's Vancouver's longest serving fireman in the entire history because he joined up, you're supposed to be 21 he joined up when he was 19. You'd live as a granddad. But he served in fought every major fire in Vancouver is through the fire hall number one on Gore Street and then one on Beatty Street. And then after about 1950 became the head of the civil defense in Vancouver, and until his retirement in 1955. So he retired here with the bars on his eight bars, 132 years or five years of service. And yeah, great career. And it's very daunting. I'm almost afraid to kind of look at what he did during that time, because it'd be so much fought every major fire in Vancouver from 1920, up to 53 years. So and so he took so he retired 55 This year before I was born. So I was really moved out here, you know, and are the lift here. What am I saying? And so I was really lucky to grow up with my granddad and grandma, and stayed with them every summer and Saanich. So I learned a lot of things from him. But one thing I didn't learn too much about was war, because he never talked about the war. And those of you who know, veterans that have seen, you know, particularly fierce fighting, which my grandfather did. They didn't talk about it. He wasn't a braggart. He was a man of a lot of accomplishment and highly accomplished men don't kind of brag too much. And so he was never like that. And, and I was always interested in military history as a child. But you know, this is the time of the Civil War centennial. So I was into Americans, military history and you know, old wars World War One seem too recent and too familiar to me kind of in a way so I never really asked my grandfather too many direct questions about the war. So a lot of what I'm going to show you tonight is based on or this afternoon, is based on memories of conversations, and then records from different institutions which helped me to reconstruct his his experience in the war. So those of you anybody, and some of you probably all know this already, anyone who's researching a veteran in World War One, there's some great websites, the Canadian Great War Project. And there's other ones Canadian archives. And they, if you know the number of the veteran, they can, you can get an amazing amount of material from them I sent away to Ottawa and then they sent like about a 50 page stack of information. And the most important document, the first one in it is this at the station paper, where you attest to what you're going to be doing. This is where when you enlist, you fill out this and just got, you know, all your stats, previous service, and then swearing oaths of allegiance to the king and in the army and all that stuff. But this package of material that they sent me basically charted his whole journey through the war. So it's really invaluable thing, if you have a relative who's a veteran in World War One, this is a goldmine of information that will flesh out all the stuff that they never talked about. This isn't his papers, somebody else's. So I use that once I got a hold of that I got all this after he died, of course, which is couldn't verify things or, or get more information out of them, but tacked it on to what I knew from from him and other families. And I also went to, he served, he volunteer, he volunteered for one unit, but then ended up in another one and I'll get into that in a bit. But he served with the 47th battalion, which is now the rule of Westminster regiment back then it was the 47th battalion newest Mr. Fuse LIRs. But he ended up in his regiment, you didn't join it originally, but he was he was posted to it drafted to it when he was in England. But to get more information about his history, he had the attestation papers, it has sort of day to day record, when he was wounded and evacuated and all these things. But I wanted to get more information about his actual unit to kind of put him in the war, like Where was he and what happened. And so I visited the royal Westminster Regiment Armory in New West. And all of these arteries are a treasure trove of info. They've got little museums, and they have all kinds of, you know, displays. And most important of all, they have a lot of written records, oh, here's some of the displays, you know, uniforms. And you know, stuff like this. This is a a bottle with some material that was taken from Hill 70, which is one of the fiercest was vicious fighting in the war. And so somebody in the museum collected some rubble from a scene of some very hot action, and it's in the museum. So there's all kinds of these very personal mementos of life in the in during the Great War. It's really we're seeing this exhibit. And most people don't know about these things, because they're in armories. And nobody goes into armies to check out things, but it's a treasure trove of information. And this was probably the most valuable thing I found there was the original war diary, and official records of the 47 Canadian Infantry Battalion, CF Canadian expeditionary force. And so this is the day to day record that was kept by various officers detailing the action of the 40 sevens. And so, using the sources, the station papers, the Canadian war diary, and other archival sources, I was able to piece together some of my granddad's story in World War One. So my granddad was born at 95. This is Vancouver in 1898, three years after he was born, you still see the forest here on the edge of the city. It's an amazing aerial shot. Made up because it's a drawing, but this is a main street here. This is all filled in here. Now. And this is where my granddad was born in a house on Union Street, down there sprayed at the one end of the Georgia viaduct, it's on the edge of what is now called Hogan's Alley, which has a you know, getting a reputation as a black community. And it was a black community in the 30s and 40s. But when my granddad was born here, this was a community of Scandinavian fishermen and longshoremen because his father worked for the New England fishing company which is right here. And he was also the CPR launch fireman. So that was, and then so my granddad grew up in this small town, small city of Vancouver. He apprenticed as a a cabinet maker, but he wanted to be a fireman. I've got a great letter that he wrote or a speech that he wrote to some association, where he's talked about as a kid seeing, you know, the, the horses in the, you know, the steam driven pumps and stuff going down the road and the bells and stuff. He said, That's what I want to be. I want to be a fireman. So he joined up here he is in 1914. You know

Speaker 2 14:48
19 year old joining us suppose been 21 but he has a began a long, illustrious career and this is just some of the shots and Firehole number one which is now the fire health theaters. I think it's the theater Vancouver, everybody's got a bear mascot. And this is, you know, they got rid of the horse drawn, you know, pumper trucks pretty early. And this is a fancy, I think it's a Danford ladder truck that my granddad drove. And he's sometimes he'd be the main driver. And then these, these, these vehicles are so big, you had to have a steering wheel on the front and one at the back to operate the back wheel. So my granddad was often on the back part. And you had to you know, you're going around these dark corners, you got to pay attention. So, that was his chosen career, but he also was very interested or you joined the militia. And this is the six BC regiment Dooku Konatsu. This is taken around 1900 a marching in downtown Vancouver somewhere, and he would have been about five, six years old, and he may have seen these sort of events. And so it inspired him to join the militia. He joined the militia, I think he might have been younger, but 17 and served in the six BC regiment do Cocottes on rifles in the militia, but he served as a in the 18 field ambulance, he was sort of into first aid and stuff. And of course, the BC regimen is still here, do coconuts. Like I said, it's the oldest regimen in Vancouver, it was originally an artillery unit. And then they decided around at 99 to split it into to keep the artillery and then make a rifle battalion. And people weren't too happy about it, for some reason, but when the Duke of tonight decided that he would take lend his name to the unit, Rosa prestige a bit and of course they're still there. And now they're a motorized unit of the Canadian Army. Regular Army with lots of battle honors. So here's the Dukkha connotes going into Vernon. So my granddad was in the militia is a you know, teenager, went up to Vernon to train. And here's his unit, you can feel the ambulance and that's my granddad right here probably 17 or an 18 year old and so used to be a field ambulance attached to the the regiment. Here's another shot with his comrades. And just interesting see the uniforms are up in the Okanagan. So they're wearing you know, these big straw hats and stuff. So this is all Vernon, which should. Vernon is kind of an interesting place because there's a huge field there. And the Okanagan Calvary kind of took over it and but when the war started out, it became a very important training ground. And it was just other shots, we have a lot of shots, these are from her family photos, tiny little brownies that I scan. And I've never seen them this large, but they really give you a window into those times. And then in 1914, the age of 19 he married my grandmother here who was 18. And so he married in 1915. April, just before he turned 20 and began to think of a long career in the in the in the fire department. But so 1916 rolls around, and there's a lot of pressure to to enlist for people. And the 100 his regiment, the Dooku CONOPS sixth regiment raise that overseas battalion. Now he's overseas battalions. Well, they were just the the local regiment, the overseas battalion of the regiment. So they had their own uniforms, their own badges, their own spirit decor. This was a Vancouver regiment that was heading out to, you know, fight in the Great War. And so he enlisted in March 1916. And then this is sort of the initial parade ground. And that's my granddad somebody with dear old dad, but he's 20 years old in this picture in the Duke of connotes Own Rifles uniform. So yeah, 20 years old. That's where you know most of the recruits in those days are not recruits volunteers. This is a church service. It was done in Stanley Park on May 28 1916. After the regiment image raised this you know, Sunday service at Brockton oval, and I found that on the internet, but we also had pictures in our family albums. Showing my granddad here with my grandma's brother Sam who enlisted as well. That's my grandma with her young brother, younger brother Sam, lounging around in the park before they head up to Vernon and here they are marching into camp in Vernon 150, eights for more training. There's my granddad here. And it's interesting when you look at stuff from this time, you know people get photographs made and then turn them into postcards like this as opposed to Alright, so they probably had a photographer photographing these guys are going by, and then he would sell them. You know, we want your picture. And so I have a lot of pictures with him in sort of crowds. And I think they're available to, you know, any of the soldiers and to send to their, to their loved ones. And there's just a detail of them here, marching in, looks all excited. And there's a camp at Vernon, I'm sure some of you have been up there. And it was a sprawling camp. Each one of the battalions had its own sort of segment here. And this is where they train for months, I think from train here from about June, June to November, when they went overseas. And so here's the Duke of cannot zone, all of the, you know, battalion camps had the, you know, sort of the headquarter place. And they're all decorated with these rocks, painted rocks. Kind of interesting. So the Duke of konad, 758 battalion, see Yeah. And there's 158, just out on parade in Vernon, with the amount of officers and regular servicemen in the background there. Just as his platoon in the 158. Camp, and there's a lot of pictures of him horsing around, there's my granddad right there. And that may be his Uncle Paul. I'm not sure. Or he's not his uncle, his brother Paul, because they both enlisted at the same time. This may be the two of them there. Yeah, I think that is Uncle Paul. And there's a lot of shots and goofing around. Like you're, they're wearing MP stuff and looking at my granddad kind of funny. And there's lots of other pictures, they don't have showing them wearing other uniforms from other troops, like, you know, like, there's one of my granddad sort of dancing around in a kilt, and stuff. So you get the impression you're having a really good time here, and really excited about the great adventure that you're embarking upon. Now, of course, there's always a bear mascot. In all the units, this has something to do with Winnie the Pooh. And let's think about bears. So they had their own regimental bear. And this is just the, you know, a Sunday where they've invited the public coming in and hanging out around the camp. So they're using Vernon and then he shipped and so this is where these out of station papers come in really handy. This is a casualty for him, because he was eventually he was wounded. And so they basically transfer this information from somewhere else, but it has all the stuff that you need to know about your ancestor and Bart, Canada, 14th, November 1916, arrived England 22nd of November, so pretty fast, seven days across. And then he was in England for quite a while at Seaford. And but you can see, just at a glance here, this is a chronology, and I'm gonna base a lot of his talk on, you know, its companies, and then eventually proceeded to draft. So they came to their see Ford up in the upper left, which is a huge training base in East Sussex. But what happened with the 150, as soon as they arrived in England, you know, they expected to be sent to the front, you know, and serve there in some division, but they were immediately broken up. So right away the 158. It was basically a pool of men to create to make up for the enormous casualties that were happening on the front, they weren't ready to, you know, bring in a whole other battalion, and, you know, integrated into the command. So they broke up the unit and it was a he was transferred to the candidate, the first Canadian reserve battalion, which is just a sort of a holding tank, because bad word. They're just a group of men who could be drafted into units on the front that needed them. And so, in during this time, he's going through lots of rigorous training, he becomes a sergeant and he's demoted again, become a corporal and then I don't know what's going on there. But then he reverts to the ranks and to proceeding overseas. And then in June, about late June of 1916, he is drafted to the 47th battalion, newest Minister few years and then sent to France and then taken on strength with his battalion arrives in the field on the seventh teats of June. And they were in

Speaker 2 24:26
sort of a a bivouac camp. So he didn't see action right away. He was in this camp. And here's a interesting postcard. I don't know who this guy is, but there's my granddad and this must have been in France because now he's wearing the uniform of the 47th battalion, which had a very unique batch. So now he's a member of the 40 sevens battalion New Westminster Fusiliers. So this is the situation 1917 Battle of Vimy Ridge is has just happened you know, in April. You know, the bloody fighting Then he repeats, which was the first time the Canadian Corps fought as a as a single command or unit, not as a command because it Vinnie, the Canadians were commanded by British General but that changed with the subsequent battles that lens and he'll 70 But this is um, so there's a Vinny here, you can see lens is right up here and there's the Western Front, there's long line. I don't know how long 15 miles, no, it's longer than that. But anyway, it goes from the coast all the way down here to sway to the German border. That was the front line that was basically established around 1914 and did not move. And so most of World War One was very, you know, people were in the trenches, just trying to push this line back in one way or the other, or at least with the allies, it's usually going towards Germany. So the situation here, so my granddad, the 40, sevens at this time, the 40 sevens had served me. But by this time my granddad arrived, they were in a bivouac in a little town outside of lands. So we arrived in that town, went through some more training, and then they decided to make a push on the city of lands. And this had to do with the third eat offensive in Flanders, they're going to make a big push in Flanders. And this was a very tenuous situation here because Vinnie, even though the Canadian said, you know, the Allies had taken a position on me Ridge, they still hadn't pushed the line too much. And things are down, boiled down to a stalemate again, the French army had been destroyed and champagne at this time, like really massacred, and the French actually mutinied, the soldiers said, we're not going into this carnal house anymore, we're not gonna be machine gunned down mass, and they just, you know, desert it and left their units. And so, and the Italian Army had just been defeated. And by the Germans down, and if CompareTo, I think, so, they're ready for another push here in Flanders, a third battle of Flanders and so lands, the Canadian Corps was involved in an action to divert German troops from the main theater up here. And so the whole idea of the battle lens was to distract the German forces in there. That's your evidence talked about shown earlier. But that's Bimi and lands, you can see the very, very close to each other. But although everybody's heard of Vinny, very few people have heard of lands or Hill 70. I think that's changing. So here's lands in 1917, the city was completely abandoned by the French, probably a year or so before this. And so the British said, Hey, good. Anyway, the commander in chief thanks, decided that the Canadian Corps should take land, like take the city. And this has not happened in the war yet, you know, there had been no urban fighting at all the city, though, is just, you know, is just a mass of rubble, that sort of lands. This was sort of some of the actions that my grandfather was involved in was fighting in this kind of situation. There's no clear trenches with booby traps is underground trenches, but we'll talk about that in a bit. But that's sort of the train that my granddad's company or his battalion was forced to fight in. So this was a very, you know, this battle of hills 70. And lands were very significant, in some ways, even more significant, Vinny, because this was the first time that the Canadian Corps fought under Canadian command. So I think it's very significant. And it was also the strategy and tactics were devised by this man, general archery later, Victoria, he was a real estate agent, I believe, before the war started, sort of chopped off his head up here, but he became a very Abel general. And this is what amazes me when I read you know, about or study, you know, some of the individual soldiers, a lot of them were very, they weren't professional soldiers. They were in the act of militia. But when it came time to join up and and fight and do their bit, they certainly did. And part security was in the militia and rose to the rank of general. And like I said, the first time that Canadian Corps was under a Canadian pan command with a Canadian strategy. And this is a book that came out last year, I really highly recommend it to anybody capturing Hill 70. I reviewed it for the BC. What do you call it? Anyway? BC Bookworld. So it's online if you want to read my little take on it. But it's a fascinating book, very in depth study of a hill 70 candidates forgotten battle in the First World War. And there's reasons why it was forgotten, and I'll get into that. So this is sort of the situation of late August. And the British just gave, you know, curry total command of this thing, but they wanted him to take land And but curry didn't, he was aghast at all the slaughter that had been happening and he didn't like sending, you know, infantry against mass guns. So he invented this idea of the creeping barrage, which is to use artillery to take out the opposition before you put your troops, the flesh and blood in the line of steel. And so he had this, he developed this idea of a creeping barrage where the troops would advance. And then artillery would fire away and handed that back and just soften up the position and make a mess out of it, to just save lives to save Canadian lives. But this was a brilliant victory, or a brilliant, brilliant fight. So it took part it took place in two parts was the hill 70 battle, which is up here because Hill 70 was a rise of land. If you saw it today, you wouldn't even think it was much at all. But it did have a command of the valley and the city of lands, which was occupied by the German army, various units, a lot of guard divisions. And so kind of the elite of the German army. And so, Cori hatched this plan to this was his plan, bite, hold and destroy. And so basically what they were doing, and this was an attack, and usually when you attack fortified positions, the attackers suffer huge casualties. The curry went against that sort of fourth pattern, and had a lightning attack on August 16, where they charged up the hill took out the German trenches really quick, and then prepared for the counter attack. Because the whole idea of this battle was basically to kill as many Germans as possible, and to just distract other German divisions from the main scene of action, which was in Flanders, north of here. And they did this very effectively for at least a few weeks. And so they took Hill 70, just overlooking lands, and you can see the, this is the the line and they moved really quickly took the hill, and then it quickly turned all the defenses in the opposite direction. And they wanted the Germans to encourage the Germans to counter attack, the Germans mounted 20 counter attacks, to try and take their old position. And the end of the day, August 1718. There were, I think, 5000 Canadian casualties and up to 20,000 German casualties. So it's a very effective strategy. So they basically took the jet, the German trenches, turned everything around the face the other way, put a lot of machine guns in there, and the Germans counter attack 20 times and they were just moan down and heats. And it was a brilliant victory. By holdest, destroy. Unfortunately, they they got a little carried away. They had a very striking success up here. But the attack that hill 70 would have been planned for months and months, like the battalions actually went out and trained. They had fake targets, you know, they knew exactly what they're doing. So Curry was very excited about the success up here, but they still hadn't taken land. The German Army was still well ensconced in lands. And so he ordered another attack on the 21st of August. And this is where the 47 was involved in, and other units of the tents, Canadian Infantry Brigade of the fourth Canadian Division, and that's my granddad's unit here. He's in the 40, sevens, company B. And they were already to a

Speaker 2 33:26
just go in and try to flush the Germans out of this, of these ruins suburbs, and you see all these little dots here. This is all urban. And they're just streets that kind of look like this. This is the approach to the suburb of CTA. CTA do Mala. And so the German said, you know the city was destroyed, the Germans had occupied the destroyed buildings, and the fortified them all with concrete. And they had all kinds of trenches in here and booby trap doors, some of the few houses were standing, they would have hand grenades side of the doors like it was a real, a real hellhole for these troops to advance into. And here's just another map showing the city to Milan, this is all the ruins suburbs, and their goal was this thing, they'll pack a trench. And that's the 47th which was two companies which headed out this way on the morning of the 21st. And right away. One company ran into little opposition that my granddad's company was hit with machine gunfire gas and all the while the artillery are throwing like a huge barrels of flaming oil and stuff around like when you read about the conditions these men had to fight under it. You know, it's amazing that they did and they're all of course wearing a gas masks and stuff and very difficult fighting. And, again, this is the kind of train this is all from the City Mall and just the ruin landscape that they found themselves in. And this is from a historian wrote about us the attackers. The Canadians found that when they were held up by machine gunfire, it was impossible to dig into the rubble. That's consolidate the ground. And the only way they knew how this would probably be the only time in the war, that urban warfare on this scale would be attempted. And I remember hearing this years ago, and I thought, Well, that can't be but you know, when you study the war, this is one of the only times where, you know, urban fighting took place. And this is from the war diary. And there's the actual diary there, the fighting was of a house to house character throughout, the fighting was most severe, being a hand to hand nature and 100 of the enemy were accounted for including seven and wounded prisoners. There's a telling line, the situation made it unwise to take many prisoners. So they're in this vicious fighting, and you just can't take prisoners. So, and a lot, it was handled fighting with the bayonet. And this is a count from an individual in another battalion, but it was involved in the same attack. And there's pictures from the sea table and showing the destruction and the, in this battle to the death, the shelling was nerve shattering. Every one of us saw his chances of getting out alive, disappear by the hour, we no longer wondered whose number would be called, we speculated who would not. So that's sort of the situation. People finding themselves in here. So I don't know if any, if you know about this gentleman us is Philip Cornwall, who was the commander of the company when all the officers were killed, or severely wounded. And he my granddad fought under his leadership in his fight. So Cornwall, who won the VC in this fight with my granddad, for not with him fighting what he kind of while was an interesting guy, he was a Ukrainian immigrant to Canada, who was a bayonet instructor in the Russian army, Imperial Army. And he joined up and joined the 40 sevens now actually joined up in a, an Ontario unit, and like my granddad, their unit reached France and that was broken up and put into reserve and he was assigned to the 40 sevens. And he was the corporal in my granddad's company or platoon. So I granted fought with this, this guy, and you read his exploits he you know, it's amazing. And this is the citation he got for the VC. His section, which included my granddad had the difficult task of mopping up cellars, craters and machine gun emplacements under his able direction. All resistance was overcome successfully and heavy casualties inflicted on the enemy. In one seller he himself Bayonetta three enemy and attack seven others in a crater killing them all. On reaching the objective, and machine gun was holding up the right flank, causing many casualties. Corporal carnival rushed forward and entering the emplacement killed the crew and brought the gun back to our lines. So, you know, amazing fighter, and my granddad was involved in his fight. And I remember an aunt or my grandmother telling me years ago when I was a very young boy, saying your granddad should have got the VC along that corporal, something like that. But I didn't know at that time. Nobody was talking about DC Corporal. But he was in this fighting with was still carnival. And Cornwell accounted for 20 of the enemy, actually, you know, amazing fighter. But they did take prisoners. I mean, here's a whole bunch of you know, of German fishers some of Canada's bag that lends another postcard just showing a Canadian troops from 47 escorting these prisoners back to some other shots from the city of Milan, you can see some of the German fortifications that were in the, in the in the town, they were actually whole blocks of houses fronting streets that had tunnels pushed all the way through the houses. So it was a very difficult place to fight because he never knew where the enemy would turn up. Here's some soul Canadian soldiers coming out of a tunnel that had built under the streets probably incorporated into a sewer system that was used by the German guards. And so people pop up everywhere, you know, it's just catastrophic fighting. But oh, I just wanted that one comment there is from a soldier who was involved in 40, sevens. He said, The Tac eventually did fail. They took their positions, but they couldn't consolidate them or move forward. And one individual called it a complete failure, heavy casualties and nothing tangible to show for it. So a lot of people thought this was a bit of hubris on the part of curry, you know, he's very excited about his victory at Hill 70. And then sort of launched this sort of more an ill fated attack. And whilst almost as many men as in the big attack, not quite, but there was sort of a feeling that this was an unnecessary feint. And but at the end of the day, this was the frontline in the first of July, and then after the middle of Hill, battle Hill 70, which is up here and lands stadium Land, the Canadian, the frontline moved this far at least, and captured some ground. But lands was held by the Germans till the end of the war. But the battle was successful in that it distracted a lot of diverted a lot of German divisions from Flanders and, and like I said, inflicted a lot of casualties on the German army. And one of them was my grandfather. And here's a war diary, or some archival material from the New Westminster regiment. And there he is his regimental number, and a list with all the other ones. It's interesting all the offices here are named wounded officers, as the names mentioned, but these are all the ranks down here, just numbers. And then he's also appears in this other book, that's my granddad in a list of wounded from a B Company, 47 battalion. And there's an interesting shot because he was so he was wounded in this fight. And he was he was wounded on the 21st was probably in the, you know, the initial in the attack, you know, with with Philip carnival kind of wall, and he was hit in the upper arm by shrapnel, which tore a big chunk of his arm. But he didn't even notice that at the time. That's what he told me. He said, You know, I was in the fight. And then an officer came up to me said, you know, so look, and he looked in his whole sleeve was just drenched in blood. But he was so full of adrenaline. You didn't feel it or anything. But the the officer sent him back. And it's interesting, the Globe and Mail did a, a story on this fight on Battlefield 70. This year, and showed this picture and my cousin got to hold him, he said is that granddad because I mean, it's no way to tell really. But he kind of looks like I'm in the wound fits. He's got his right arm in a sling, he's being escorted to the real rear by a German prisoner. And this was a standard practice. The prisoners escorted the wounded to the walking wounded to to the rear. Another thing about this battle, and this is what's so well documented in that book, there's a whole chapter on the medical side of it, of the army. And it was just so efficient, you know, like, you know, here basically is the battalion, the front line, so they have battalion stretchers, your wounded here, you get taken by to these regimental posts, and then have to feel the ambulances and one of these were connected by light rail. So it was very rapid. So if you were wounded out here, as long as there were battalion stretcher bearers to get you out, once you got up to these regiment lead posts, you were on your way to all these different stations and then finally to the ambulance trail, railhead, which takes you to a General Hospital, which is where he went. And this was a Tammy Air France. And this was a small little rural town, beautiful little countryside, and it had large extensive fields. And so the Allies decided to turn this into a hospital depot. And

Speaker 2 43:00
this is the one that my granddad went to General Hospital number 11. And it's just gives you an idea of the facilities and they were, I think, got some information on him. Maybe down here, yeah, there were six hospitals with 12,000 beds to take care of casualties. And the interesting thing about this hospital it so this was July, late, or no sorry, August, and the Americans had entered the war a couple of months earlier in May. And the first Americans as far as I know that were in France were medical people, surgeons, and they took over all these hospitals. So my granddad was treated by American hospital people. And in September just a couple of weeks after you arrived there, the whole place was attacked by two German aircraft to drop bombs on the different hospitals and the Americans were aghast because they had the American flag flying over this hospital one anyway this is something interesting this was the you know, this is another thing you get from these war records you know, they have all the medical history here and this describes his wound and the operation so go small baby can't read it as a doctor right? I cannot something healed wounds getting no trouble. They're gonna get me there. And here's the officer's name. So I don't know all the details of his wound but it was severe enough to you know, he to have him evacuated out so here you know again this the wonderful record that's preserved in these papers you know, left to join unit join us evacuated wounded and then with something upper arm that it and then eventually on. In September, he's insulated and sent to Seaford to England. So he had one of these wounds. I think they called it a flighty wound was severe enough to get you out of the action. So it saved his life and preserved our family That's for sure. So I almost you know, in a weird way, you know, I'm most thankful for that German shell that scattered the shrapnel that wounded him and sent him out of that. So here he ended up in Seaford and recovered by October he was really well recovered and this is in East Sussex is on the waterfront, a beautiful area. And so here because he had a lot of training in physical education and stuff, he they decided to keep him here as a physical education instructor to train troops in the use of the bayonet and sword and then rifle. And so here he is with his group at some competition at Aldershot. Yeah, the physical and bayonet training headquarters. So he's very much involved in that for the duration of the war. And that's the back of the postcard, which is kind of the bestest love to Wi Fi from hubby. And you know, he'd been this is 1918. And he'd been away for a few years. I never knew he called my grandma wifey. And now this is a really cool shot that I've been really looking forward to showing you. This is 100 years ago today, in Seaford, and you can just see the happiness on the faces. This is celebrating armistice at Seaford, 11 1118. And soldiers from all different units there. That's my granddad right there. Looking really happy because he's heading home. And this is lands after the ward lands became kind of a famous place for people to go see erect city. And so all these postcards come out, really, and they bootable or they're cool, you know, ruins of the Great War, to showing the people as they came back and imagine the daunting task to rebuild your city, you can already find out where you live, you know, but they clean the streets off first. And so there's lots of these postcards showing people going back and trying to figure out how they're going to make sense of their lives. And this is this terrain that my granddad fought in his first action in the war, he rise there, he basically almost just got there, and he's thrown into that wounded and then out.

Unknown Speaker 47:17
Oh, the top part of that

Speaker 2 47:23
is my granddad was my auntie Jean, who's still with us, just turned 90. So this is about 1921 I think that picture was taken. So there were 625,000 Canadians, enlisted and World War One. or so 420,000 served overseas 51,748 Killed in action 138,000 wounded in action. And this doesn't include of course, people that died from illness, which were substantial amounts, but a BC 55,570 enlisted out of a population of 450,000 Pretty amazing. More than 10% of the overall population. That's not the man that's the man and the women 43,000 served overseas, which 6225 are killed 13,000 wounded. And I used to ask my granddad you know about the war? Well, no, actually, I didn't ask them too much about the war. I remember just be a Christmas they said what was your regiment 47th battalion. And it's kind of just stopped there because I didn't know the right questions. And then the Christmas before he died, he had a bayonet that I loved. I had this banner, you know, when I go visit him as a kid, he let me wear it, you know, I can be a pirate and stuff. But on that Christmas, he gifted me that bayonet. And that was used in the city of Milan, you know, in that very vicious fighting. And so and I took that opportunity, say, Okay, we're all sitting around the whole family, I said, granddad, could you can you tell us a bit about the war. And he just sort of sat for a second and then looked at and said, none of it made any sense. That's all he said about it. And I think he was referring to the that vicious fighting that he took part in at lands. And the, I think the anger of the servicemen that they were put in that position after a very successful victory until 70. They sort of went ahead and did some rash attacks, that many enlisted men thought were, you know, unjustified. But anyway, he he survived and went on to an illustrious career. And, you know, had this title in here, the war that will end war. And just today, I was kind of going, looking at the Internet. And there's this interesting study at Yale, because I was thinking, you know, people said the word End All Wars, you know, that was there's, there's a sort of an irony to it, or they look at it sardonically now and they forget the idealism and the hope behind this kind of message that motivated these guys to enlist, and the stats kind of show it. The number of battle deaths has declined since then. In The World War One, these are the annual deaths from 1918. To 2016. And nation, the nation wars kind of stopped around here. And internal domestic wars began to take off. But actually, and this is what this professor whoever is doing the study said the World War One may one day one day be noted as a watershed in the transition to a more peaceful world. And when you think about the results of the war, you know, destroyed three empires, you know, the Russia, the Witch left a lot of legacy in our lives. But I want to leave you with that hope about the war. And yeah, and thank you for listening my talk. And just Yeah, to think about these individuals, you know, the names of people here, all of their stories are very similar to this. You know, and but you know, a lot of these, well, not a lot, but a substantial number of did not come back. And then my granddad was able to come back is in horrific fighting. And then went on to a very useful, successful career serving people in Vancouver for four years as system fire chief, fire Holman one. Anyway, thanks. And

Unknown Speaker 51:22
it's kind of a long talk. Any questions? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 51:31
You're grandfathered in. But it's very common response. You definitely did, Greg. But the data experience tells us that it was just such a traumatic experience that isolated from an audience they had all that could begin to understand what they went through, but there was an impact that you could talk about the order. So to that extent, likely your grandfather was emotionally scarred. Do you ever see any sign?

Speaker 2 52:09
Never with him? Never. He was always very nice. I was just talking my mom today. about it. He's always the, you know, always referred to my grandmother. He was a very take charge kind of person, very accomplished, whatever he did, you know, handyman stuff. And he retired 1955. So I only know him from living in Saanich. Island View beach, so he didn't seem traumatized at all seem very confident, man. You know, I used to hang out with them walk, walk down to the beach, we gather firewood and stuff and taught me how to use a chainsaw and all kinds of things. And I never got the sense that he was emotionally crippled or ruined by it. But

Unknown Speaker 52:51
came back with PTSD. I was called shell shocked.

Speaker 2 52:55
Yeah. Yeah. And you've told me stories about people here. Who came back to Salt Springs the same. And as you mentioned, they don't want to share experiences with except other vets. And that's what my mom said today, like he would hang out with veterans. And of course, they would talk about this stuff. But not amongst, you know, their civilian friends. From the Second World War as well. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, no, it's amazing. It's good to remember what they did

Speaker 1 53:31
for sharing your information with us today, and we appreciate it. I'm going to wrap up the program here, those of you that came in late. Have a look at various information here that reflects Saltspring contribution to this forum and more. So thank you for coming. Enjoy your rest of your afternoon

Speaker 2 53:57
just one little addendum, this is a new monument that was erected to commemorate Hill 70. So if you go to France to lens brand new spanking monument to commemorate this. What's that? What is it? I don't know. That's a male to protect from shortcuts.

Speaker 2 54:20
No, yeah, no, that's, yeah, you know, you wear this on? No, and I'm like, here for you know what people are savers. But that's chainmail. I mean, that goes way back

Unknown Speaker 54:34
to where he was mounted. Oh, yeah. Calvary

Unknown Speaker 54:37
guy would foresee heaven. My grandfather was the way they probably knew each other same time period. Little overlap, because he was from Nike 14 to 55. Yeah. We're the I bet he knew each other for granted a trained fireman. He trained hundreds. Wow.

Unknown Speaker 55:07
Driver on that horse.

Unknown Speaker 55:09
Okay

Unknown Speaker 55:13
friends fire truck is down in sight. Really? Yeah.

Speaker 2 55:19
Oh see what was his name? Greg Brady, okay, you know what firehall

Unknown Speaker 55:30
picture and his brother's picture down

Speaker 2 55:37
pictures in kids but that's gotta be firewall number one. That's my grandma's firewall number one. Now interesting. Read the book. Like a history of the Vancouver fire.

Unknown Speaker 55:51
No pictures of my grandfather and we'll get

Unknown Speaker 55:55
good. I'm getting that because I know where the museum is. Oh, yeah, that one my own coffee. Bill take this as context. To Lawrence. Cool. Oh, that's wild. I'll do some research and let you know.

Speaker 2 56:19
I've got the the first one came up. It started with the Ronald. It's all about the fire engines. Yeah. So it's it's kind of rare. I'm sure it's out there. But yeah, it's a really interesting book if you're into fire engines. Who? Yeah, there's Churchill. He that's when he was killed. And that's his brother, who he never came back. So we don't share. So this this, so I think it was Alfred Churchill. He was he was killed in action. He's a left tenet. And I'm not sure about him. But we have this on the archives. Like do you go to our archive site? Sorry. Oh, he wasn't here. He was from Vancouver. These are the salts springers. who enlisted and the stars are the ones who died?

Unknown Speaker 57:13
Yeah. You say

Unknown Speaker 57:14
the percentage of the males in Saltspring. Making 14 went towards must have been huge.

Speaker 2 57:22
I mean, compared to the stats, I mean, they were up there 124,000 compared to the rest of DC, which was 94,000. So it was quite a

Unknown Speaker 57:37
great chunk. Well, thank you.

Unknown Speaker 57:40
It was really meaningful. My father was shot I think 96

Unknown Speaker 57:46
or 94th. Western University.

Unknown Speaker 57:49
Oh, wow. Yeah. And they were actually much like your grandfather. They were split up once. Yeah. Okay. I

Unknown Speaker 57:56
think he went to camp with us. We have so many photographs.

Unknown Speaker 57:59
He was quite into photography. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 58:03
Yeah, there's little things. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 58:06
Yeah, I think he ended up in

Unknown Speaker 58:11
Italian Oh,

Unknown Speaker 58:12
they were dirty. So very close to

Speaker 2 58:17
Yeah. The 46. The 46 was right next to the 47. And that's why reading

Unknown Speaker 58:23
that, you know, he, as you were saying never spoke about?

Unknown Speaker 58:27
Yeah. Well, you should get his attestation

Unknown Speaker 58:30
stuff. I was wondering where do you go?

Speaker 2 58:33
I think it's called the Great Canadian War Project. Or I think that's it. And it's a really fancy site. And it gives you a lot of information. And if it's not there, it's on the Canadian archive site. is a Canadian War. Yeah. Yep. So they're digitizing everything and transcribing, but there's, there's tons to do. But I think they've got all the attestation papers, okay, for that. Yeah. I didn't know they'd send it all online that you have to send it, you got to send it and then they gotta get a stack of photocopies. It's just awesome stuff.

Unknown Speaker 59:08
There's quite a bit at UBC as well. He wrote a letter later on, because talking about the, the, you know, from from one bank to another. Wow. He apparently shared with this. They wrote back and forth for quite a long time. He's super valuable. Yeah. So I'm interested to know because yeah, he would never even actually go pick up this metals.

Speaker 2 59:29
Yeah, yeah, I got that. And like I said, I was really into war when I was a kid, but I don't think my granddad really dug that.

Unknown Speaker 59:34
No, no.

Speaker 2 59:36
Yeah. Yeah, I was like, you know, Chris has little soldiers

Speaker 2 59:50
the same time, maybe it was in the Dukka Konatsu. You'll find out oh, yeah. That was that battalion. I shouldn't talk more about it, but they were most See? Non British? Yeah. And actually some people comment on that I go, I don't really like this unit, because there's like Scandinavians and Japanese and stuff in it. But no, there were no Japanese 147 10 Japanese. And that's what I'm not certain

Unknown Speaker 1:00:16
of 46 Because once you lose track of like with this little bit, but

Unknown Speaker 1:00:22
to get those papers, because I do

Unknown Speaker 1:00:25
have a little book for me. I know when he got two or three

Speaker 2 1:00:33
No, yeah. No, it's amazing that that stuff's out there today. Yeah, I was pretty happy

Unknown Speaker 1:00:49
on that Wow,

Unknown Speaker 1:00:53
you got all those photos, you should scan all those in.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:59
Like if there's no idea where they're from, you know, right.

Speaker 2 1:01:02
Yeah. Yeah, it's the same with us. Unless you recognize somebody in it. Exactly. Here we are. Blah, blah, blah. Right.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:18
This is Christmas. it off. Turning it off.