Accession Number | Interviewer | Conversation with Charles Kahn | |
Date | April 8, 1997 | Location | |
Media | cassette tape | Audio CD | mp3 √ |
ID | 139 | Duration |
139_Bennet-Ellen-John_Family-History.mp3
otter.ai
20.02.2023
no
Unknown Speaker 0:01
If I don't get it work down. Tell me. Can you tell me a little bit about your family? I have to hear that your your family first came here
Unknown Speaker 0:15
my mother and father, my older sister, and your older sisters Evelyn, Evelyn Lee.
Unknown Speaker 0:22
And then there's Mary in June. June Stephens best spec Demetri
Unknown Speaker 0:29
Demetri Oh, yeah.
Unknown Speaker 0:34
So, what are your father? What was your father's name?
Unknown Speaker 0:38
John Edward. Edward. Came from Australia in 1910.
Unknown Speaker 0:48
And about when they came you were you already born? Oh, no, no, no, your business app? No,
Unknown Speaker 0:55
no, no, no. My dad came to Canada in 1910. Okay, okay. When he came up to Smithers and telco and that region, Hazel, and he was slashing that right away for the railway that was going to Prince Rupert. And then in 14, he joined up when the war broke out and went overseas propria Rupert, while he would be joined in Smithers, he went to British Rupert, and then went down to Victoria went from there. And he met my mother in England and my 50 year old sister was born. And 9019 They should have honestly quite a bit older than five and a half years. That's not that much. And then it was married anyway. My sister Marian sister judo and so we were born in Ghana.
Unknown Speaker 1:45
The hospital was there that
Unknown Speaker 1:47
community said it would be our cross railway station that was
Unknown Speaker 1:52
and where did where did? Where did he settle your father? We were both with it here.
Unknown Speaker 2:03
Yeah. All right.
Unknown Speaker 2:12
I never realized you were up in this area.
Unknown Speaker 2:17
I live normally. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 2:19
So when When? When you were here, that Duke fellow that we were talking about? He was he wasn't here that? Oh, no, he was. The joke learner talks about
Unknown Speaker 2:34
I don't know at what point do clip
Unknown Speaker 2:45
the 12 acre we're sitting on right here with a separate piece to the old place over there. That was a 30 acre piece, this one to 12 acre. And it was owned by a family named Seymour at that time. And my dad got a 30 acres from the soldier settlement board
Unknown Speaker 3:01
so that the Seymore that see more heights if you know anything about them.
Unknown Speaker 3:08
Well, the old man Seymour, I never knew he was in Vancouver, but the rest of the family I didn't know.
Unknown Speaker 3:17
Wilfred Seymour was the one who had this 12 acres here. But he got a house right about where the little barn is. And when he I think he was overseas in 1915, when the house burned down
Unknown Speaker 3:32
one of the things I'm trying to do is to identify the who the names who each road is named. Because that's I find that really interesting name and it means something I mean, it means a lot more than than sea view heights. Or heights means a lot more than sea view heights. So it was your father was your father farmer, a farmer,
Unknown Speaker 3:54
Farmer logger. He went to fishing later. Who was nothing in farming a
Unknown Speaker 4:01
lot of farmers also
Unknown Speaker 4:03
were loggers. Oh, yeah, well, Oh, yeah. Well, he had to farm and I guess a lot of the land had lots of wood at that point. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 4:09
I mean, it's it's pretty clear now but it must have been pretty pushy there. Were they were there was a lot of what we now calling old growth up here. Yeah, that was what it was. Yeah. Yeah. All big trees and big tree. theatres must have been like an endless supply and those Edward
Unknown Speaker 4:29
the demark right place now. Just 12 acres belong to Wilfred. And the old man Seymour. Over his father had the 70 acres next door and my dad wouldn't tie him went to Vancouver and approach old man Seymour about a feeder tree way up in the woods there. Then he wanted to build a canoe needed to get a dugout canoe. And he got the tree and he fell it involved a 14 foot log down with a horse ahead and he made a canoe. In 1938, there was no money and that police went back to the government for taxes. And in 49, it was the timber was sold off and we picked it up in 52. And we sold it again at 60. We had erected a wall we had to set it to put a roof on.
Unknown Speaker 5:21
Did you remember you remember was farming right here? I mean, it's a land good for farming. She brought to
Unknown Speaker 5:33
market gardens. No, no. No, we had a garden for them. Believe it or
Unknown Speaker 5:39
not to fail. Yeah. This whole area is pretty pretty hard for me right through the cranberry toy area. It was okay for sheep. There's pockets of good bargains there and for raising sheep. A lot of a lot a lot and people on the island seem to have lived in in this area right through into the cabinet members
Unknown Speaker 5:59
who've done it about a point to
Unknown Speaker 6:00
their salaries listening to a tape that Chuck coral made by talking about. He's talking about the different schools on the island. And the primary school felt like a really rough school from where did you go to school?
Unknown Speaker 6:14
We used to walk down from here down to Blackburn road and along Blackburn road. The way to school used to be we got to divide school. Yeah. I went there from grade one to grade eight.
Unknown Speaker 6:27
How long have you been here besides important for three years you are already schooled and I wasn't married. That's why I came here. I call myself a display forbear I
Unknown Speaker 6:43
did feel like coming on here. We're going to a good safe place. Well, I was 18 years old and I didn't know a soul and I'm terrified in the boat. And we came to Vancouver and say was joining sister for a night and went down to come across on the old Princess Mary that came to the island. And there's the headline button the better and safer suspected Japanese submarine and nothing inland waters. If I had trade fair in my pocket, I would have never seen so terrified to get on the boat for starters. And to see that I was absolutely sure that we'd be blown the kingdom calm before ever. But the weatherman was wonderful. After pass was like a middle pond. And of course the President that area was right there was a big enough boat. Just cruise through the water anyway. And the boat ride was wonderful. It's just a gorgeous place. And I figured that if today's people were handicapped for money like it was they saw some of their problems instead of you know, when I came out here, but I didn't lead and like the situation. I couldn't have gone to the government and said I didn't have the money. I want to go home. I don't like it here. Actually, there's still quite a few resorts with people on the island. It's amazing. I have friends who they have, you know, maybe six or eight different jobs. Yeah. And each one brings in a little bit. Together. You scratch by. That's right. That's right. I think it's an interesting place because people have always had to be resourceful here. Things haven't changed. But in our day and age we were taught to be resourceful. Yeah, we were never taught that the world is Olivia. You don't like your job you quit and you go to welfare and get money. So when you first we were first married, what did you What did you do for a
Unknown Speaker 8:37
hydro truck he
Unknown Speaker 8:37
drove drove.
Unknown Speaker 8:39
I drove truck for Ganges per year. And I quickly want to triple my own. That was in October of 45. Is it winter was setting in
Unknown Speaker 8:52
4444 Well, How soon did you start filming? 94 was our first door. How many children do you have six, six. We had to be resourceful. That's for sure. I found I come to enough
Unknown Speaker 9:12
time as a family grew. And there wasn't enough money to go around. We lived out of the bush in the beach. We we lived on venison and clams and fish. We didn't ever wrote the beef in our house three years. We couldn't afford
Unknown Speaker 9:31
to do you. Did you feel depressed? No. No, no. Everybody else was in the same boat. We all help one another.
Unknown Speaker 9:37
We went to the dam since Yeah, we went to a show. The two bids to get into a show. We're exactly with Rex here. Right we're in a Korean is now building. It was the gunners. Yeah, their theater was built on the Jackson Avenue side of it. And it's been torn off since
Unknown Speaker 10:02
Oh, I see. Okay, that buildings really been used for a lot of different things
Unknown Speaker 10:12
Incidentally, I went to school with all of our guards down here at Dubai, it's cool.
Unknown Speaker 10:17
So when you when you when you were first here and and raising a family.
Unknown Speaker 10:28
You said most people were in the same position. But there were a lot of rich people on the island to work there. There was a few do a lot of which rich people are well, more well we could. We didn't write in a rich we considered them to have some money. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 10:40
yeah, I'd be English and the people. A lot of people here who had the best accent you've ever heard in your life, but they've never been spoken in England. There was a body of people called the upper 401 heard about the Johnny's aunt and uncle came over from England, his mother's brother and his wife. And I took them shopping in Ganges. Bulletstorm with a couple of Damn the accents up there. And we got other street again and Uncle Burt said to me those people come here from England. No, they've never seen England. He said he didn't think so. I never heard that. Never heard that accent anyway, he said. I think a lot of a lot of those people who grew up in Victorian and went to private schools. Oh, I'm sure a lot of them did. And they were probably a lot of them. Their fathers were remittance man. Yeah. Others had the accent. Yeah. Yeah. Now the upper forehead a guy was in the Blackbirds. Oh, no. Got it over the bow. I thought there was so somebody told me there was a there was a, I guess, in the Blackburn house or another house nearby? Where that they that they often had meetings. There's not meetings but evening parties. Oh, that was in the Blackburn house.
Unknown Speaker 12:08
Yeah, we get what years later? Well, that's we're gonna house was empty as long as I can remember. From the time I was old enough to remember until about 1946. Oh, really? It sat empty. Completely empty.
Unknown Speaker 12:21
Didn't fall apart? I
Unknown Speaker 12:23
mean, with no, I don't think so. No.
Unknown Speaker 12:25
During that.
Unknown Speaker 12:28
I believe Cohen's brothers I believe. Now, I would say they owned it. I'm not sure about that. But they had the run of the whole place anyway.
Unknown Speaker 12:41
But when I came here, wasn't there. A manager in that place? And they
Unknown Speaker 12:45
had a wait a minute. I'm wrong about that. No, no, I'm wrong with that.
Unknown Speaker 12:55
It was empty for many years when I would go into school. But then the government got a hold of it. And they had the mentally handicapped. People from Wilkinson Road, working on it with a manager. That was where Charlie Moore was the manager. That's right, right. That's right.
Unknown Speaker 13:16
But when would that be? 44 When I came here, and it was going strong, man, that wasn't too long after that, but it was sold.
Unknown Speaker 13:27
Would it be in the 30s?
Unknown Speaker 13:31
In the 30s maybe was a depression type of typing activity A lot of people
Unknown Speaker 13:37
who would run by the government anyway. I know. Quite a few veterans who were mentally challenged they say today Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 13:45
well, they weren't who weren't there they weren't they were just slow. They weren't getting back to this upper 400 I'm interested in what you can't you can't quote me because I can't say name and
Unknown Speaker 14:04
it was it was several families and single hangers on that had this phony English accent of varying degrees. And they thought they pretended to be the English aristocracy. And the likes of us and various others who were not of this bunch words. I don't know what they thought it was I couldn't care less because that sort of you know, so that bothers some people but it never bothered me. Now the name The name I had was connected with this was Karpinski, which doesn't sound English at
Unknown Speaker 14:44
all. For all know he's a public even bought the place in 40. He had
Unknown Speaker 14:48
nothing to do with the other die after he came here. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 14:54
oh no, we're talking about the 30s later, but krupinski He was a public came here. He was from Poland. He married an English woman. And they came out here and they bought this place. No, they, they draft
Unknown Speaker 15:11
the exit group that somebody had told me they I can't remember how they got that scrambled in there was that house had a huge dining bowl living. Okay. So for I don't know, two or three years, maybe four, by at New Year's or over the Christmas holidays would have a ball in there. That was where that came from.
Unknown Speaker 15:39
They sort of blend into their 400 Right? Yeah, they weren't. They were not
Unknown Speaker 15:46
a property in the Jackson. I mean,
Unknown Speaker 15:50
they sort of came to salt free and they blend it into the
Unknown Speaker 15:53
form and he was a colonel in the army. What were their first
Unknown Speaker 15:59
name was Adam,
Unknown Speaker 16:00
Adam and Diana Karpinski que hierro. That's
Unknown Speaker 16:07
the sky sky.
Unknown Speaker 16:15
And one of his relatives, I've never been quite sure. Who would sit with a cousin or uncle or what? Well, he married into this upper 400. And he just died here. Well, but that he stayed on. So how did he get the name after 430. But couldn't it
Unknown Speaker 16:39
have to be an expression from something? Somebody? You know, like, when I came here, his younger sister, we were terrible that we gave all kinds of people weird names. One of the women that used to be her husband was the owner of the full fertility, old footprint. We call her the dollar deduction. Because she was tall and straight. And sort of a domineering presence, even though she wasn't really a domineering person dressed to the nines at all times. So we've got another guy that lives along the road that was kind of funny. We call him Donald Duck.
Unknown Speaker 17:22
She was the only woman and the person that I've ever seen. Who would take a full glass of beer, open her mouth, and pour it down. She never swallowed. Alright. This is the woman at the property. Yeah, she's actually opened her mouth and poured the beer down her throat. She never
Unknown Speaker 17:43
lost lots of funny history. And and it turned out as the years progressed, and more people came here, this whole thing just sort of blended out and disappeared, that there was you gotta remember that was only worth 1200 People were when I came here.
Unknown Speaker 17:59
And one of those people is still living and you have to be very careful with
Unknown Speaker 18:05
one of these upper corner people
Unknown Speaker 18:07
who still want to get in and wonder Victoria, brother and sister.
Unknown Speaker 18:10
Some of them may have gotten the may have gotten that handled, because they were just sort of in that group going. There was several of them in that group that were not the colossal snob. Some of the others were. But it was two or three of them that I really liked. And they were really nice to me. But this class structure never bothered me because I felt if you're my friend, you're my friend, right? If you don't want to be my friend, so I don't care. What's your friend when you went to dances like you're saying, you went to dances? Did you did you did some of these people go into
Unknown Speaker 18:52
you intermingled? Everybody
Unknown Speaker 18:54
intermingle? And where were the best if you went to football mostly? Not always. They had some again, Jesus old man Hall, the odd one at Central. But basically, the dances were open because it was a much bigger Hall. And everybody dad's from everybody else in those days. You know, it wasn't like whether the dads and dads are the same person. All right, like they do now. And did did. Did people come from both ends of
Unknown Speaker 19:19
the island? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Sure. Were there.
Unknown Speaker 19:25
Quite a few of the population. Yeah. So getting around when the problem is. This is this is only what 40s and 50s. Yeah, for for Hall home in the 40s and 50s.
Unknown Speaker 19:38
And it was covered with monitors in the 40s and 50s. And some of the environmentalists saw this right in the 50s. They don't understand is that they walk through the bush they say Oh, you got nothing grows. But when you walk around and see the stumps that are behind these trees that are about 70 to 80 Higher. Some of the times and love some places three times since I've been here
Unknown Speaker 19:59
yeah If the environmentalists will tell you that when you cut the trees a third time, nothing will ever grow again. That's hogwash.
Unknown Speaker 20:05
Everybody seems to have a different theory.
Unknown Speaker 20:09
When they say just in our time since the beginning of time there, how many times at that hill over there being covered with different trees? As the same all over BC? Sure. Concrete every 100 years old? Yeah. The only reason they're 100 years old, because 600 year to go to his nobody here to love them. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 20:29
Well, I like I like the way tech faders logging because, you know, the fella who works he says that in 60 years, they'll take all the trees down, but they do a third every 20 years. So you really actually look better after they cut. Like what they did on Merrimack solar a couple of years ago. I thought it looked nicer. I never want to see it. What they don't realize there's a cycle. Okay. On larger areas, this may not happen. But small places like this. I mean, any clear cut here was not big enough to stop sell seeds. So they clear cut the tree. The first thing you get after the trees are cut is you get all this coming up by the 1000s not only replaced, but lots of places. You get foxglove you get wild blackberries and wild black cat records. That's what we're getting now in metal forming. Right. And that cycle will go and pretty soon. The oldest you'll see fruit trees sneaking up there and the alders fertilize the fruit trees, they're full of nitrogen. The roots in the alders are full of nitrogen, which everything else loves. And as the trees progress, and the deer have a field day because they get all lichen off the branches and stuff. Okay. As the thing progresses that's all boulders come up. They find the kill out the berries and the fox. And then the bird trees come along and they kill out the alders. It's a natural progression and it's a natural progression. I mean, I've watched it I was very kid not knowing about this. I've lived there. So how long would you say that takes from? Well, how long have they done this subdivision?
Unknown Speaker 22:37
This was clear cut, well, clear cut and bulldozers were taken out in 74 and 75. Yeah, that's 20 years. And at our daughter and son in law's house just over there. There's fruit trees now three feet high. So in amongst the older and the older and are all gonna be crowded out 2030 20 You're
Unknown Speaker 22:57
just over 20 Over here, I
Unknown Speaker 23:01
bought all the timber on. The acreage belonged to one of the lumber companies in Victoria. And we felt freezer six feet through. And right down to minimum size for love and wisdom he loved it was a moonscape. And within a few years, you couldn't see a deer 100 yards away. It was all grown up the second group timber and now there's trees over there to feed through. And that's indulgent. 54 though that's what 43 years it's year to buck to dinner. So in 40 years, I've grown up again to beautiful timber and just thick and all the limbs, the bottom Linder dying and falling up. You got Trump's clear Trump's now 3040 feet high in that
Unknown Speaker 23:49
the art theory for reforestation and the tariff cuts on the bigger ones instead of sending you out there with a shovel of a bunch of trees. That Fridley you only see along the highways with a brand new highway that sprang up with fertilizer and stuff. Well, they're collecting coals and growing their own trees, they could collect cones and get the seeds and mix it in that fertilizer and scattered, scattered over and clear cut. So the trees will come up thick a pair and a dog Jack and then the strong ones survive and you get a beautiful cleaner timber. This way they're going Christmas tree farms isn't so full and not make anything except what you see in New Zealand. They actually grow them that way. They cut them all down and then they plant them all these little rows and then you see them coming into the play Christmas tree. Yeah, it's not actually right here in our deck. When you came into this big tree right beside the deck.
Unknown Speaker 24:44
I planted that in 1972 brought it down from up north feet high. That thing is still limbed right to the ground. And it will be forever
Unknown Speaker 24:56
because Carol and I keep them off
Unknown Speaker 24:59
the ground you couldn't walk under it. Oh, I know when you couldn't
Unknown Speaker 25:03
bucked him off about that far off the truck, they were right at the ground.
Unknown Speaker 25:09
But I'd say when it comes to these planting, as you were saying they might have been neat rows. But here's the plan on 10 feet apart. We were up north, I grew up, I used to go up north hunting moose. And one year, quite a few years ago, we get into a plantation there, where you could see a moose any distance away in the little trees. And the trees were Christmas tree limb right to the ground there. Were in there years and years later. Now these pretty good 30 and 40 feet high and they're still in the ground. No, all those limbs are getting bigger. They won't die and fall off like they would have decreased with thicker limbs got dark for light, and they die and then they fall off their trunks. And the tops keep going up for like right, but when they're planted too far apart, they won't do that.
Unknown Speaker 26:04
Every time I used to go to an outdoor show I used to hit from a minimum Rodel booth and I'd go in and start talking to them like I was environmentalist. And then when they got really upset then I tell him I was pulling your leg Hi when x logger who believes in cutting and milling again, their crops like tomatoes. And I tell them what I think about reforestation being done in my opinion being done the wrong way. That was true those seats should be broadcast onto that lock over ladder instead of patch nurseries and then planted out in neat rows where they're too far apart.
Unknown Speaker 26:44
In terms of something like Mount Toro, okay, how long ago was that witness Murray Cypress was there 20 years ago
Unknown Speaker 26:53
been going on there since time began when a man here fuse logged up there for years and years donkey logged all their flowers are all grown up to timber again. Natural loon seeded from the trees were around the outside edge very log of
Unknown Speaker 27:09
all that logging born
Unknown Speaker 27:13
it's not that many years ago
Unknown Speaker 27:14
it isn't years ago maybe.
Unknown Speaker 27:17
Maybe it had
Unknown Speaker 27:19
to be that's when Stuart road was
Unknown Speaker 27:25
at that time track of the years
Unknown Speaker 27:27
and Marie up there weren't too long before weldwood When that big protest was on and famous here that when that protest was on Makiling six years ago
Unknown Speaker 27:36
and I get nose to nose with photography
Unknown Speaker 27:44
Stuart road logging and Merseyside for so long was not very long before that because they were screeching and yelling that it would look like
Unknown Speaker 27:56
look like Stewart road Stewart road that was that also has his land that he had
Unknown Speaker 28:03
some of them but there was half a dozen guys involved so so what do you see now then you're saying is only about maybe 10 years old? Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 28:12
Yeah
Unknown Speaker 28:14
it's interesting because you know, if you don't know it's hard to gauge how long it takes to grow like I was I didn't we're not areas grow better than others. Yeah. What do you got a mouse gunner alive
Unknown Speaker 28:33
just kidding
Unknown Speaker 28:40
So we came back to teabags.
Unknown Speaker 28:49
Right, I said I don't worry about it. I'll get it later. He doesn't take it away. Did
Unknown Speaker 28:57
I when I was I think I was telling you that I'd written it doesn't work. When you can you told me didn't read books. This this is a book.
Unknown Speaker 29:05
Have you seen hiking?
Unknown Speaker 29:08
Anyway, I spent time with all the all the islands and one of the one of the islands I included in the book was text data. And text data, to me seems to be almost all ours. Which means that it can't be have been logged all that long ago. Because there's hardly any first left. It's mostly
Unknown Speaker 29:30
Well, if there aren't any seed trees,
Unknown Speaker 29:33
then it would never go to food. That's right. You can never create everything. We used to beat the bird didn't they? After they love that excellent thing to burn. But what happened was the old loggers used to leave and he didn't. Some what they call feed Creek concrete was about the cold. Wind took care of deforestation. And burning was excellent because it made us or for the theme but they're starting to do that again I think they're they're starting to actually start burns because they they they feel that they they made a mistake by not allowing the natural burn to occur but it
Unknown Speaker 30:17
depends the way he does it lightning strikes Yeah, it burns off a whole layer and he's right down to Arizona new trees grow we always think we can do it better.
Unknown Speaker 30:25
We can we think we can. We can but I still say if they scattered seeds instead of planet tree. See what the one of the ideas was when they started this tree planting was but of course like everything else and governments fritter away all our money. And so they never have they never have anything to follow up a plan. They start out somebody gets this grandiose idea Well, sure it employs lots of people and I'd be great team in their jobs by a longshot. But they never carry on with the follow up plan. Follow up plan was they were going to send a crew out there as the trees got so high. Like when you have a Christmas tree farm, you prune your trees to make them all nice. So what they were supposed to do, they were supposed to send people out with machetes or little axes or whatever. And they were supposed to live these trees so far. Well, the odd place they did it, but 99% of the places they haven't done, so you're not well, you might have knotty pine lumber, that's barley, you're going to have to go through pulp mill. Yeah. And this one guy said we went to buy lumber one time, he should have taken a gunny back because it was so full of so many holes in the boards that are legal to get together. Oh, well with dry rot, coffee trees, just making a joke. D grade loggers something that I should have taken a gunny sack instead of a truck. But that's the problem. Nobody. They get all these wonder children in government who read a book. Like we had a friend that was in the forestry group ever since practically the end of the war. And he said the forest rangers, they used to come out from high school and they be flunkies and work their way up to their assistant Rangers. They could work their way up Rangers. They did all their training in the field. Okay, then they decided to make this a course at UBC. So they were supposed to do so many years at UBC and then go for a year of whatever practical experience the city kids come out for their practical experience they're gonna be the great foresters. He said I get him out there in the bush and they don't know one pre from another. You know, they looked at pictures in books. But instead of taking them out, like he said, if they took them out for six months, or if they took them out every summer, and said okay, now you get out and get a job in the forest and you'll get so many credits. By going in the summer in the forest, they can cut one year off their UVC they sat in that damn University and they never went out in the bush. So we said we got a bunch of Bush book pushers out there when you're when your dad came here in 1918 did was Had there been a lot of logging done at that point, you know logging but I had a lot of the islands and logs are no no no just little pieces here are mostly on farms I guess. So when when did the the big logging start on the
Unknown Speaker 34:01
donkey? yard or steam donkey came in 1928 Hello, my name is Mike lumber bitch. Brought a steam donkey and three partners with him.
Unknown Speaker 34:16
So he came from off Island.
Unknown Speaker 34:17
I don't know where they came from. They came over and they set up first down here in the Valley at Blackburn lake. It was a golf course today. Across the from the golf course on that side. You live in that valley. They worked there for several years.
Unknown Speaker 34:35
And were they shipping the lump that we're shipping the wood off the island or were they willing all had to go off there? I was all booked up
Unknown Speaker 34:40
and sent away when there was no mailing. There was no mail here. No. Stuff like that.
Unknown Speaker 34:46
Building there go the concrete drop.
Unknown Speaker 34:50
Yeah. And then from there, there were quite a few horse lovers supposed to call them. So we're all the depose horse lovers. Thrilled. No, no, no, no
Unknown Speaker 34:59
During the markets were in danger. And we just
Unknown Speaker 35:02
need gypo much smaller. But a lot of them there's a couple of old horse loggers still living on saltburn today. All right. Oh yeah. Real Beach is one of them. He did. He did, horseless Oh sure. sale was 83 years old now he was a horse lover.
Unknown Speaker 35:19
I heard that he's not well, or it could be at three years old
Unknown Speaker 35:29
and he graduated from but he had a dairy farm at the same time and did it all in flowing with horses. And he was a real horse man. And one day he traded his team in our tractor. And everybody laughed at you all a third you're giving way to new technology.
Unknown Speaker 35:47
When he when he would be happy with the tractor. Oh,
Unknown Speaker 35:49
I believe so. Yeah. Yeah. And then of course he he was always a logger. He worked he hooked behind cats.
Unknown Speaker 35:57
When but when was he loved three gifts. He must have been logging from work
Unknown Speaker 36:07
I don't know when he finally quit logging. But he was still hooking behind cats. And
Unknown Speaker 36:15
so this Mike Rabinovich that you mentioned you think he was the he was he was sort of the first one the first one he brought the first donkey and then after that, the mouse and
Unknown Speaker 36:27
real quickly after that, the bulldozers came gasp donkeys came
Unknown Speaker 36:33
but that would have been heading into a bad period with it. I
Unknown Speaker 36:36
mean, that's right depression it wouldn't have been
Unknown Speaker 36:39
so it probably got nipped in the bud at that point.
Unknown Speaker 36:42
Normally gets carried on people still love people still. Love delivered and Vancouver already told her to those. Yeah. And he left here in about I think 1936 Mike well the donkey was taken away and he left and
Unknown Speaker 37:06
they took the donkey away.
Unknown Speaker 37:08
I don't remember what happened to the donkey. The last two settings he had with it. I know. One of them was just down the hill here. And the other one was on the Cranberry Road on for years y'all spark we stood on the Cranberry Road. And in 1941 My dad and I fell this park free down here and cut it into wooden and sold it. In fact my sister Mary got pictures of a tough on the springboard with a crosscut saw falling tree when they were five and a half feet on the
Unknown Speaker 37:40
just thinking I could do the picture in that snapshots. isn't their view on our big log.
Unknown Speaker 37:45
There are a picture out of me. Maybe with you after taking another look. In Dickstein V book. Yeah, no, that's
Unknown Speaker 37:55
not not the one with the crosscut but sitting standing on a log on a truck.
Unknown Speaker 38:00
That was Walter Janeski. And it was it was your right yeah, I know that picture. I remember what I was thinking. It was Chuck Carl's father in law Natalie's
Unknown Speaker 38:12
that's what made me think of it because I just met chuck a couple of weeks ago. And I remember talking to Natalie and realizing her name was domestic in that way. And Father Walter tetragonal picture. Oh, that was in the 30s. Yeah. So early 30s.
Unknown Speaker 38:29
And I think that prep had solid rubber tires.
Unknown Speaker 38:32
So were the grinders also starting about that time in the early Oh Garner
Unknown Speaker 38:35
doing and going quite a long time, man. Yeah, Gardner does pretty well quit. Well, okay. No, Garner's as far as I know. Love very little unselfie. See Joe and Tommy who was a big time lovers and all of her lawyer. Yeah. Albert was up in Cornell. He too, was a big time lover up there. But they never loved themselves. They moved away.
Unknown Speaker 38:57
Didn't they move away with their mother who stand behind all of her unfurl?
Unknown Speaker 39:01
They behind in 1926 They left? Well, up until then, Tommy Garner had driven a Model T Ford logging truck. There's a picture of it. But they never actually exaggerate common to make make the marble piece into trucks. We made lugging trucks out of area.
Unknown Speaker 39:20
I mean, there must have been strong. What do I tell you when you have old car and plowed into something you had to throw in pretty hard? It wasn't bad enough you fall into something at two miles an hour is nothing. They were made of iron and steel is not flat. We're actually the theory is the theory with the new curves is that when you pile into something, the car takes the impact of those things. If you pile into something you'd be looking at a lot of other words no, no the word because while they were careful. There was one One to one or two people killed in one year after I came here and one guy was he was hauling the logs. And he embraced gateway. So instead of staying with the truck and trying to steer it
Unknown Speaker 40:14
out, you're wrong. He was thrown out. He didn't jump to Burgess. Really Burgess was thrown out. He had the door off his truck, so he could just all right. That wasn't when the truck actually went down the hill. He tried to ride it out. And he came around a corner and he hits a bank, uninsured the front of the crop off like that, and he went out on a truck and a load skewed off that way. And a trailer ran over him on the road. The truck went underneath it agreed and stopped. And he was on the road. run over by the trailer by the trailer by the trailer. Yeah, I went and looked at it when it first happened in 1946. There's a locking door on his truck. If he didn't have a door on his truck. He has been okay. He just made that it was he was thrown out because the door was busy. Oh really? Yeah. That's taken in 1951. I hold that load down nails and back up here, down the field and down to forward.
Unknown Speaker 41:20
And where were they where were these these rooms and they were pilfer rid of the head of the bay. How many rooms were there?
Unknown Speaker 41:26
Tell him how many Willie Brown there were around the onsolve in the heyday of logging in the late 40s In the 50s there were up to 40 outfits logging at one time on both rings really? And I can show you starting as a head of Fulford harbour you come out around Ganges around the north end down through the narrowed Romney development and back again they show you where there were 55 Lug dumps
Unknown Speaker 41:50
are those spars that you see are those remains of the older were Senate well there's there's something there because I do a lot of paddling and you see them and I always wonder what they are over the ferry dock No, no, no.
Unknown Speaker 42:07
That was a love dump. Oh, really? Right there in front of the end. But you've turned into a Point Road. Yeah, all that area there is Oh, Chris cribbed with logs. Yeah, that's all of them. I don't love there for years. I spent off and on I was grew up loving drugs for 14 years myself. under you, if it were a place where you could go along and stop on the side of the road. And it was a decent bank into the water, where you've got a bunch of boom sticks around and over. Nobody said boo. Today they have to study it to death to see what the impact will be on the environment, then tell you you can't do it.
Unknown Speaker 42:48
This crazy world
Unknown Speaker 42:51
there is a logging truck that I made out of 1932 Plymouth four door sedan
Unknown Speaker 42:59
the size of those trees right now that little things I've done in corporate hardware looking at Maxwell capelli farm, you know we're compelled by the little white church, yeah, just pass through the white shirt towards so that they can read
Unknown Speaker 43:22
that little truck I cut it off behind the front seat outward, cut it off at the back window, the back seat and the centerpiece and throw it away and welded the back and back up again. So it was a little pickup truck. I put 18 inches in the frame. I put a four speed transmission behind the three speed in the cross oximeter a built in here with a four speed transmission and I took the springs and threw them away because there were too long, too long and I put shorter rings in, built them up to 16 leaves with a big old Graham, Adri randonneur and adapted 16 inch wheels do it. I know what your six ply
Unknown Speaker 44:05
656 data was strong and strong enough to pull this kind of thing. On the other hand,
Unknown Speaker 44:10
I could pull it over these Hill.
Unknown Speaker 44:11
So what kind of what size of motor would there be
Unknown Speaker 44:14
the four cylinder just the four cylinder and was strong enough to pull it? Well it had 13 feet forward and seven rivers and the trailer with a front axle out of a three ton forward and I had a master cylinder mounted on it and a rod going up to the truck and flexible cable early trailer hitch and then a lever in the cab. I took the seat out and we're in bucket seats in. We had a gear up here. The gear shift here in between was a lever that I could lean on when the brakes on the trailer. I brought that up Musgrave. Oh really,
Unknown Speaker 44:52
you know when you talk about Musgrave mountain that's my Bruce
Unknown Speaker 44:57
Musgrave starts at the gravel pit at the foot of the hill. At Musgrave Road,
Unknown Speaker 45:01
yeah, no, I know where I know where Musgrave is. But I, I was asking somebody, some people I, for some reason I used to think that when we talked about Musgrave mountain, they were talking about mountain twang. Oh, no. But it's rootedness. Because that's where the farm with Musgrave farm was. Over towards it was back in between the two. Yeah. Between 12 and
Unknown Speaker 45:21
it's actually much great mountain. But mountain route is the peak. Oh, I said mount Brucey is the peak of Musgrave mountain.
Unknown Speaker 45:33
And how does Where does not fit in terms of relevance.
Unknown Speaker 45:37
Another piece, that's another peek at the meta field, when
Unknown Speaker 45:40
you talk about Musgrave mountain, you're including the area both of Bruce and
Unknown Speaker 45:44
the whole business.
Unknown Speaker 45:49
Now, when when, when it goes back to before before you were here, but but when Musgrave was here, and they have a big sheep farm there, yeah, there must have been sheep in there too. Because they run they run the whole thing. Sure,
Unknown Speaker 46:02
with all growth timbers and the forest Slayer floor would be would bear and a lot of it. And it grew grasses. And, indeed bring them in new leaves everything on the brush.
Unknown Speaker 46:14
And the sheep would all be in with the old growth, for sure.
Unknown Speaker 46:18
We achieve here, in the wintertime we had a home flock in a bush block, and a bush block in October would disappear. They just separate themselves away from the home flop and they'd be gone. And they go way out across the park road and down to their slopes going down to the water. In the spring. They'd all come home again with their lamps. And they'd be around here all summer, fall, they'd be gone again. I'd have found a cord we shared they wouldn't butchered the lamp, the flock took off again.
Unknown Speaker 46:50
They're pretty well, they pretty well prepared themselves. That's interesting. I wondered how people kept track of them because I was talking to somebody in a lot
Unknown Speaker 46:58
of cases you didn't have a quality woman is bringing Yeah, can you recognize a sheep and they come on when it's bringing us lots of tender sheep named Oh, really? Okay.
Unknown Speaker 47:07
Did you did you have them identified in some way or did you actually know that he
Unknown Speaker 47:10
knew the sheet you know that we had it? We had a mark on their ears. Yeah. Hey, Bobby coming down in Fulford valley here, it will always the end of the right ear and a hole in it. Oh, really? Throughout the brand. That's right. And another guy had to Nick's out of the left ear. Yeah. Other people had different things, um, put tags in them. Our Mark was the tip off the right, and a nick or the end of the left. That was our mark.
Unknown Speaker 47:38
I heard a story in the north end about Gavin mulch sheep, and how they used to Easter come down to stonecutters Bay. And then they just go off the offensive to see this woman what used to watch them and one would go off and then they love it. We just follow them and they lose. They lose all kinds of sheep that
Unknown Speaker 47:58
way. There had to be dogs behind them that really wouldn't up they're not letting me know sheep are not living there. It's
Unknown Speaker 48:07
just garbage just like let me
Unknown Speaker 48:09
know, if sheep went into the season with dogs behind them. They do not know I would question that very much.
Unknown Speaker 48:15
So it was interesting story because it obviously they couldn't they couldn't keep track of their sheep. So I wondered, you know, when they're when they're, I guess there's a certain amount of loss that you'd have anyway, dogs are a big thing. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 48:27
Dogs are still big clubs kill a lot of heat. And it was Cougars here too. Yeah, they come and go.
Unknown Speaker 48:35
Do you remember any? There weren't any any, anything like bears or wolves?
Unknown Speaker 48:40
And bears? No wolves and bears disappeared? before? There was one bear here is what 1928 For a short time and somebody shot it. But before that wolves have disappeared.
Unknown Speaker 48:52
And there was one shot in the valley. Well, that
Unknown Speaker 48:57
came over here in 1847 46 points that we shot and 48 came over by itself. There was two of them.
Unknown Speaker 49:03
We're gonna just go across
Unknown Speaker 49:06
here, but they never had talked to were just the two worlds. One was one would poison and one was shot hair.
Unknown Speaker 49:14
It's interesting. There were all those Cougar sightings last year and they put up all those times but no, no, we don't hear anything about them.
Unknown Speaker 49:25
When coolers are here, you're going to find dead deer. And they will get into dead sheep, the sheep herd. Sooner or later. They are going to the sheep herds and nobody ever found any dead sheep. They're down at Ruggles there was supposed to have been a couple of dead sheep found. But who identified it as goober work I don't know.
Unknown Speaker 49:48
wouldn't just have been a couple that we've ever given than a flock of sheep and they just create habits. They did sheep every everywhere makeover to kill them walk
Unknown Speaker 49:58
away in labor. So yeah.
Unknown Speaker 50:02
And people will die it will they will. They'll die of fright. Yeah. But they just, you know, they break their neck really whack them with their paw. And particularly young ones. It's just like a picnic. Feeling because he's hungry. They're killing because you kept quite a few sheep.
Unknown Speaker 50:24
When we had 200 and we started with sheep in 1954 We got rid of them in 64 We're not going to draw with BC Perry's and I couldn't make a run sheep to your sheep and everything else and putting full time on the fairies. I said to her one day, something's gotta go I can't do it all. So the sheep were the only thing that weren't paying by the Pharaoh and we use where they were getting income or investing I ever did. And we sold there. Still have a job on the third. I started to steam and I got up to keep officer. Yeah. Did you Did you ever work with Dennis? Oh, yeah, he was my captain. I was amazing. Oh, what's your captain? I
Unknown Speaker 51:08
didn't really have the capital. Yeah. Dennis is friend of mine too.
Unknown Speaker 51:12
Yeah. When I first started in BC, very casual. And I worked a bit at Fulford as a deckhand or a brand new deckhand. And Dennis with the mate. Lacy was the captain. Oh really. Then, years later, Dennis came to long harbor has made and I was then I went to school and got my mates ticket came back that I worked for the summer of 70 at long harbor a second or third that I took the mates job at Fulford and last month, it was just Kipper and Dennis seaward gamers master Windows less Mollet went to Lulea. So I worked with Dennis, he was a captain. And I was amazed. And that was
Unknown Speaker 52:00
all that was all in the in the old golf. Very company. BC Ferries have taken over
Unknown Speaker 52:11
BC Ferries bought out to go via origin, they have timber of 6164. I started with the ferries and 63. All I say okay.
Unknown Speaker 52:20
But then it's been around for quite a while. Yeah, he's been with the other company. Yeah. He also made a tape for the Historical Society. Yeah. So it was kind of interesting. Interesting. Listen to these tapes.
Unknown Speaker 52:35
And is it a good guy? Yeah, I like the interesting finishers going for a hip, knee pretty soon.
Unknown Speaker 52:45
I wonder if that'll if that'll improve her? Her ability to
Unknown Speaker 52:48
walk? Likely? Yeah. She was telling me one day she would leave her knee. So I gave her a few pointers on it. I have two artificial knees. Really myself.
Unknown Speaker 53:00
And how long? Have you had the moral code?
Unknown Speaker 53:04
The first one putting in 87. I had it replaced in 91. We get the word out. Or to do it? Definitely. I bought it in four years. Oh, really? Slow down. And then this one I had done in 94.
Unknown Speaker 53:19
Actually, this solo I was talking about Keith McLaren who was a captain on the suit. He's he's got the same thing. He's just he just had one. But now the well maybe when you have a two they operate with this. Laser, Mike? Oh, no,
Unknown Speaker 53:33
no, no, no, no. You're talking about the remnants. cartilage. Yeah, you're I have a totally different time cut from here down to there. So is that? Does that take a long time to recuperate from? I was in hospital 15 days.
Unknown Speaker 53:54
And when was it?
Unknown Speaker 53:56
August of 9494. But in two months, I would walk without a cane. And now
Unknown Speaker 54:04
if you were to wear wearing one out again, would they would they do it again? They wouldn't. So there's no there's no limit. Like don't get too old for that kind of.
Unknown Speaker 54:13
To me. Wonderful.
Unknown Speaker 54:17
Well, we can play standard joints and stuff now. Yeah, those all kinds of things. So when you check the sheet for the 10 years, but how many sheets did
Unknown Speaker 54:26
we at the end? We have 200 200 we started out with what 15 We gradually build it up build it up bought more and more and more. We kept labs and we got up to about 200
Unknown Speaker 54:38
Were they expensive to buy when you
Unknown Speaker 54:42
pay the base prices? Not in terms of in terms of what you had. But really you could actually buy a sheep a grown you for less than you give sell her lamb for the next ball.
Unknown Speaker 54:55
Oh really? Yeah. Oh, that's interesting. But you said that it was the least profitable things that just the world had become by 1964. Or well, what it was you only got your crop once a year sort of idea. Yeah, like in a span of months. Yeah. And we didn't have them fenced in. So that meant that the whole family and we were had another family that had sheep in the same area, which was a hole, Maxwell. So there we are on a hot summer day chasing these damn things in the wide open Bush trying to get them into a corral. It was an experience.
Unknown Speaker 55:34
They knew every angle they knew and regret. And they break away from me in a way to go back on the bush again, he has to start all over again. You just got to be too much. And then the every month, there was a paycheck with inviting, yeah, oh. And another thing. When you walked off the ship and came home, you were freed or next morning, you know, going out at midnight to the bathroom, to see how many feet there was having trouble out there. And that sort of thing. I remember
Unknown Speaker 56:03
quite a long time ago, I thought it's kind of romantic to be a farmer. So I went drove, and I talked to a few farmers. I quickly learned that that was it was too much work for me.
Unknown Speaker 56:14
But the truth of the matter is like your fellow who went into the store to buy a lottery ticket, and the young girl behind the counter said to the old farmer, what do you do if you win the big giant money? He says I'll keep on farming so she's all gone?
Unknown Speaker 56:35
Well, I think even today, I don't think people make much money on the sheet. You know, I mean, there's there's a market for the land, but it seems so labor intensive and
Unknown Speaker 56:44
do is do his money. And if you could if you had enough of them.
Unknown Speaker 56:49
I guess 200 would have been a relatively small flock of birds, I saw them used to come home. They used to go and stay away for the winter. And then they would come trooping all with their babies in the spring, which was wonderful. We didn't have to change those overheads. halfacre. But so we're gonna matter budget. Just stay out there. Go north, he didn't have to worry about whose land it was on. They just know what to do. With after one day you'd get food if you had your sheep running into me with somebody that just depending if we met at one of the big flocks.
Unknown Speaker 57:33
I don't know how many he had
Unknown Speaker 57:37
nothing even today. Like, I wonder how many? I think she said about 70 or something 70.
Unknown Speaker 57:44
They still have? Yeah. Is that right? Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 57:46
Well, I think they got them in two places, though. I think they've got some old on farm response. Right. St. Mary's Lake? Yes. St. Mary's Lake and I'm from up here. I think they have somewhere to say Maryland? I think so. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure they have
Unknown Speaker 58:08
which was covered. North End Road
Unknown Speaker 58:13
from the old farmhouse. The old farmhouse here. Well, Johnny across the road. They bought that. They bought it from Mrs. Palmer. Yeah. And it was on the north on North.
Unknown Speaker 58:25
North End row across from the old farmer's Bed and Breakfast passing mark church. Oh, I don't know what you mean. Yeah. I think that's Victoria, Canada, and there's actually a bed and breakfast in there. About an airplane across the road from but there's another one in there to farmhouse Bed and Breakfast. And then there's
Unknown Speaker 58:46
there's another one. Oh, God. All right. Oh, my daughter knew the phone but they must be honored.
Unknown Speaker 58:54
But John's dependencies across the road from from on the Lakeshore,
Unknown Speaker 59:00
right. Oh, that's interesting. He didn't mention that he had called the old farm that breakfast. That's the one on the lakeside. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 59:10
I butchered on suffering here for 35 years. In addition to everything out there. And I went to just about every farm on the island and what your something is sometimes. I need to go over to go and do many words which we do in there.
Unknown Speaker 59:26
That's where that's where we buy ourselves from the burger.
Unknown Speaker 59:29
I taught build. What's your ROI?
Unknown Speaker 59:34
I don't think he's bidding anymore. He's killing them. Slaughter plants I'm talking about Yeah. Oh, we thought about I thought Yeah. Cuz I think the actual butchering, he has done
Unknown Speaker 59:44
well, it depends how you term butchering? Oh, yeah. To me, that means cutting that okay. What renomia slaughtering?
Unknown Speaker 59:51
Yeah, I was just sort of thinking, you know, you go to a butcher and it's all he cuts it all up. So
Unknown Speaker 59:59
I Important be for pigs, rabbits, your chickens are afterward no matter what I went. I did that for 35 years now. And finally when I go to arthritic I can't my finger don't work anymore I know it's
Unknown Speaker 1:00:15
tough when you get a little bit tough when you get old and things don't work the way they you
Unknown Speaker 1:00:19
know, it's wonderful to grow old. Yes. Well, the minute you stop growing old, you're dead. That's true. That's my theory anyway.
Unknown Speaker 1:00:31
So, going back into when you were keeping sheep, you know 5046 But what else will you do to make a living really loving and loving as an operator now, with with something I remember listening to a tape of somebody who was an operator
Unknown Speaker 1:01:01
by difference would you would you switch every week kind of thing.
Unknown Speaker 1:01:07
You work five days I used to work 10 days on and 10 days off the strip. I mean, 10 days, 10 days on and four days off. So I would go in and work say seven o'clock in the morning to only change the article up seven o'clock till 230. And then I would go in and work 230 till nine. And then some of them came in. No 230 till 1130 till 11 There was nine to three
Unknown Speaker 1:02:03
I can't remember what they were, how would you work? I think we were ended up with work seven and a half hour shifts. When I first went there we work eight hour shifts. And the night girl used to come on at 11. Then she started coming on at 1130 When we went to seven and a half hour shift. And we got paid a differential for working night shifts. But we had one operator that worked night shifts all the time, except for her four days off, she used to work 10 nights and then have four nights off. But when I started, I started working part time like we used to have a shift from six to 10 for the evening rush. And so I used to work some of those and then I would work her four nights when she had the four nights off and then graduated got so that I work day shift. I got a regular shift. And when I got that that's when I worked 10 days straight and four days off, which I liked. And there was two of us for that. And
Unknown Speaker 1:03:14
I got the luck of the draw who was just strictly by accident. But I used to work my seven o'clock shift in the morning. And then my nine
Unknown Speaker 1:03:31
but it worked out that I always when I I went off on a seven o'clock shift, and I came back from my four days off on a 230 in the afternoon shift. So I literally had five days off. Oh really? Well sure because I went off at 230 in the afternoon. And then I have four full days. And then they didn't come back till 230 in the afternoon. Of the fifth day. Was it was it did you like the work? Yes, I did. It was interesting. It was challenging. And we had lots of fun. Enjoyed the people you work with? Yeah, I did. Most most of the time. We had one or two that goes crazy. But that happens wherever you work. So that's no big deal. But I basically got along with her a supervisor. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Who would have been a supervisor? Well, when I started to work there the supervisor was when the Near Miss Turner Turner was seeing in relation to the Turner non sport athlete on she came down she worked through the details she came down. She was raised in Windham or her family were in Windermere. And when she retired, Josie over and whose family hadn't appeared and Josie been an operator since the beginning of time. took over a supervisor. Was it well? Was it paid reasonably well. It was one of the best paying jobs on Saltspring was it Oh yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:04:57
So what can you remember what it takes? When you start peanuts can't remember what it was. But it was the best. It was all there was only
Unknown Speaker 1:05:10
there was only about two people on Saltspring females that made more money than the telephone operator. Yeah. One word that was pretty current, right, who worked for the police to have all the assessments BCSS on authority wasn't called that them. But they used to have an office, your tax assessor? Yeah. She worked in there for years. She made more money than we did. What the other job was, but for women, it was the best, basically the best paying job. But it was something like $250 a month or something. So in that period, from from 55 to 64, when you worked for the NBC tell you were also doing the sheep exactly the same period. And you were loving, which, which brought in the most money. We needed them all. We needed them all. While I was working.
Unknown Speaker 1:06:14
My dad said to me one time he was a disability pensioner from the first floor. We were always broke. And he said to me one day, what do you do with your money? He's I can't understand what you do with all your money, both your work. And I said, well look at it this way, you get your pension, and you're by yourself. When we get our paychecks, there's 80 of acuity. So if you had to support eight people on yours, where were you? What would you do with your money?
Unknown Speaker 1:06:44
Now No, I'm I'm, I had this great theory, which you're destroying. My theory was that farming didn't pay very well. But logging did but you obviously didn't make a fortune and did did many people.
Unknown Speaker 1:07:01
Some got rich and some went broke. Yeah, we're gonna balance it got like two people came out of it with lots of money, and property and so on. A lot of them went broke, some retired more or less comfortably. But the number that got rich, were so small. There weren't many.
Unknown Speaker 1:07:22
But a lot of them could have been rich too. But they blew their money in the beer powers and gambling and all that kind of stuff. They were big shot loggers. You know, it was the hay day after the war, they've gone through the Depression. So now there's money. And so they send it when they get in. Some of them didn't work at their job, like they own the company. But they spent their logging time in the pub or other places. But the guys that came out of it with money in their pocket, were one of the crew. They were out there, they knew who was working who didn't work, they were producing and they hung on to their money they didn't gamble it away and they didn't drink it away when they came out very wealthy so you're saying that the the crew did better than the owners to which you know, the owners did fine because they were out there as part of part of the they were on the job every morning at eight o'clock the same as the guy that worked. What didn't most people do? A lot of them didn't. While
Unknown Speaker 1:08:26
they did direct operations from home or the pub, wherever. And one thing that used to bother me was if they if the truck broke an axle instead of sending for an axle, they get a plane coming again do you did jump on the plane order Vancouver pick up an island fly back? Well, that day was shot. The axle would have been there that night. They couldn't return it at night and the truck could have been going next morning. But the expense of going to plane to Vancouver back why did he do this? Prestige mostly Sure. We'll do that to keep the crew word.
Unknown Speaker 1:09:04
So who are the ones who you said go to made money a lot of money or we
Unknown Speaker 1:09:08
wouldn't name names or whatever. But lots of went broke.
Unknown Speaker 1:09:14
So they did a lot of them go broke. He said a lot of wasted their money but some of them I guess must have lost ours because of the fact that the price of wood went up and down quite a lot. But they bought machinery they didn't need you know, come out to the garden and bigger better truck and bulldozers got bigger and better so they bought new bulldozers or most of them that didn't come out reasonably well was just plain mismanagement.
Unknown Speaker 1:09:50
Another thing that broke some of them too was they went too big too fast. That's
Unknown Speaker 1:09:53
what I mean. They got too much stuff that they couldn't afford to pay for.
Unknown Speaker 1:09:58
They want to fit here how to truck and he used to haul four or five loads and load it to the to the Whitworth Bay in a day. But he had to have a bigger truck, then the truck could haul as much in a load as the other truck hard and then they needed more crew to keep that truck going. Businesses on the one side, the Dark Side couldn't produce enough to eat the truck. So then they bought a calf and other crew. Next thing you knew they were out of timber. Yeah. And all this equipment.
Unknown Speaker 1:10:31
I guess one of the reasons I thought that, you know, people did well on the logging was because I remember reading Coronavirus books and although and from what I read, you know, reading between the lines it sounds to me like he actually paid for for Wallace by logging the secretary. Oh, that could be people made lots of money long enough to manage it well. But he never know he has a dream. So he had nothing to lose. That's true.
Unknown Speaker 1:11:09
I knew Dave and G Nice. In fact, I hold lumber for all his buildings over there from Victoria where I truck I picked up the fern wood and dumped it all up and hauled it home piece by piece and it
Unknown Speaker 1:11:25
didn't didn't suddenly have a son still around somewhere yet. I've
Unknown Speaker 1:11:29
no idea I got out of Sun son who maybe stayed somewhere in Victoria. Probably You're right. So I'm not sure he went through and graduated as a male nurse and he worked in a hospital down here for a long time. Is also basically no a nurse. Nobody son was named David has well, they have a junior or something. I can't remember. I don't know. I don't remember. But he actually graduated as a male nurse thing that a female nurse in a hospital. Yeah. And that's where he was working when he and I haven't heard of him for years.
Unknown Speaker 1:12:07
So he was working in the in the effort. For a short while he
Unknown Speaker 1:12:11
did work here as a rail nurse. And then he graduated on where he is today. I have no idea.
Unknown Speaker 1:12:20
So do you think you think on the whole people who who had the timber on their land did better than the people who were cutting it down? From the from the timber?
Unknown Speaker 1:12:33
No.
Unknown Speaker 1:12:37
Today, one of the things that people seem to do is they they buy a piece of land the cut down on the woods and make a lot of money on the wood enough to pay for the land. And they divide the land up zones of loss. And that's where the profit is. So I guess that wasn't really possible back then. Nobody wanted the land.
Unknown Speaker 1:13:01
Subdivision subdivisions didn't start here until I needed 100 hills with about the first subdivision.
Unknown Speaker 1:13:07
Harrison Avenue
Unknown Speaker 1:13:16
subdivision was the first one of the first very first of any consequence was placed with that poor Joker
Unknown Speaker 1:13:26
when they've gone into panic farm
Unknown Speaker 1:13:29
Yes, it could have been triply Yeah, it was it was going to panic place and part of TRICARE. Okay. And that was one of the first
Unknown Speaker 1:13:41
100 deals and one of them was the second. Second and third. Yeah. And for quite a long time knows a lot faster unfold.
Unknown Speaker 1:13:50
Yeah. was interesting. You're talking about the phonebook. Carol also put in the next phone but I think last year she's got a 1912
Unknown Speaker 1:14:03
Oh, that would have been grant we
Unknown Speaker 1:14:07
thought it was Oh no, no. It's all all their all their striping or something. All warm hearts. Yeah, that's right. Okay, okay. And as they've been opening it up, and opening up the old world seven subdomain making pretty sure it is.
Unknown Speaker 1:14:35
Yeah, 1912 it's all long harbor. That must have been one of the first ones. One of the one of the first ones. It was going to be the town and that was out on Fort St. Granville, and that was 94. I had a date. I was gonna ask you about that. I have a date for 1891 For Grantville. That could be that could be
Unknown Speaker 1:15:00
I'm not sure the date I no longer have our time. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:15:03
I'd like to get some more information on that. I have heard that at one time we were thinking they were hoping that they put in an emperor style hotel there. In fact that was tucked. Does that rumor anyway, the story I heard that they were trying to put the Empress Hotel in there. It would have been before the Empress Hotel. I never know what that was supposed to be. What Ganges is today that was supposed to be Tom because the little lock Yeah. And somebody for how many years, but I was not selling real estate anymore. By that time.
Unknown Speaker 1:15:51
Somebody got wind of that subdivision. It had been owned, in chunks like in a great big chunk. And nobody has really paid any attention to the fact that it was legally subdivided. Nobody even thought about it. But some guy got wind of it, and bought it. And advertise. This is where he made this mistake. He advertised to bring a busload of people starting at what used to be the local town and country shopping center. To bring them over here, he was going to sell them as recreational rocks, like you bring your trailer over and whatever else. Well, first of all, there was no guaranteed water supply of any description. And secondly, they're all on a hillside like this. Okay, they're ordered acre lots. So that meant if you drilled your well here, and I'm up on the lot above you and I put my septic tank in practically your line, my drainage is going into your well. Somebody saw this ad in the columnist. And they didn't think much of it for a little while there all of a sudden, is that where it was? Because as I said, when all the time I sold real estate, I never had we never had any listings out there, and that was 64 to 70. And then all of a sudden this ad came in the paper. Well, that got squished real fast. But that's exactly what what they did was when they started buying, they would buy the lights up and down between the roads. So they didn't have a big enough piece of property. So when you were selling real estate between 64 and 70, that's when they were starting to develop Yes. So nothing much really happened. Before that in that area. Boot canal was subdivided before I started 100 Hills was subdivided while I was selling so did Mowbray. So did Forest Hills. South Mountain Park that's in subdividing really started was between in the late 60s, early 70s.
Unknown Speaker 1:18:26
Behind the cat and Mulberry and swamp behind the cat when they built their own filter. And I know that wasn't good.
Unknown Speaker 1:18:34
But we nearly died. They were given us a bad time the owners, which were all friends, we were all friends about not selling over it. So we said to them, for God's sake. Take out some of the trees. So the people up top can see that they have a view. I mean, we can take them down there and say oh yeah, you can see St. Mary when he clear for your house should be able to see St. Mary's Lake and blah, blah, blah. I said they're looking at a forest. They all believe us. So we can't tell. So we let it go with that. One day a couple of us went out for a ride to look at something or other and we did the boat dive in. All we wanted to do was follow a few trees here and there just open up a few people so they could actually see what was going on. They left the maple trees all for Dreamland. Well, as it turned out, it was just fine because he did it all down so that stuff didn't come. But we got a whole lot of the ice and all this. For the love of God. We didn't want you to murder every tree on the place. He said what you said you wanted to view so we gave you a view was that when when Chuck coral was will Just didn't, didn't do well babe adjusted loose canal Chuck and Hawk Pringle and they hit the 100 Hills. And they did better. Yeah, I mentioned he mentioned better so he mentioned 100 hills. Yeah, but Mowbray wasn't part of 100 hills. Mowbray was subdivided by Hart Bradley Mac and Laurie Moen. And across the road from that from Mowbray's, where those houses go along and the creek goes along through their property that was called the max that was there per subdivision and that's pretty big. That's not but you see most of the subdivisions on this island were two thirds of an acre or better up to an acre or over an acre. And when just chuck and Rod their very first subdivision was loose canal like Harrison Avenue pine place down there and they set the surveyor out with a rough idea of what they wanted. And that was the last time we sent surveyor. Chuck going out laying it all out first when you bought the last canal coming in like this, okay, here's Harrison Avenue coming along like this. So lots will go like between Harrison and the water will chuck this is the head of the bay This is the ocean Chuck figured that he was slapped a lot like this. So you would sort of angle your house and look out the bay. Well, he didn't do that. He did it this way. And before Chuck realized what have you done the thing was registered shot nearly had
Unknown Speaker 1:22:02
that just the way they were survey that the way he surveyed the board instead of serving him so your loved one this way he surveyed and so they went this way. So you're looking into nothing Yeah, instead of out the ocean. Interesting. Now most of them are white enough you could angle your house different to what the children are in a rush but that was not the point. So when they did the 100 Hills, they they locked it off basically first and they left and they left a lot of trees on it. But Chuck went out from now on when chuck chuck always went and bought bundles the last surveyors tape and he went out and he sorted it out and drove these laps in and then he pulled the surveyor and said okay, the seats are in number one make them out. So when he did the 100 deals you got here's the main road and here's capital crossroads here and you've got two rules a lot. Okay. So Chuck's backwards is not Castle Crossroads is this other way. This way. He staggered the lot. So this last line is here. Okay, this is the front row towards the bay. They're staggered. They go left bunch goes like that. And this bunch goes like this so that nobody knows what he could absolutely plug the house right square in front of the other house. Yeah. You know, and so, and then they're staggered the other way so that everybody nobody could build right smack in front of everybody else. That's the way they've got them done up in general rich. Yeah. The first the first shoe boy did the first and he did a very good job.
Unknown Speaker 1:24:20
Anyway, who did the subdivision of Trincomalee that's where I used to live. Trincomalee Oh, that was Jeff Hollen Dan. What was that other guy that was Jeff partner John
Unknown Speaker 1:24:40
Walters uh, you know, fairway, golf, fairway now, doesn't matter. Have you? Thought about there? Yeah, but it's all the same area. Yeah, we'll stay in Ireland. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:24:56
Oh, that would be us. Walters was not Yes.
Unknown Speaker 1:25:00
The Jeff Holland
Unknown Speaker 1:25:03
his name would be seawater but everybody called him vs. Water is a little secondhand drop and garner
Unknown Speaker 1:25:13
that's a fair way to Trincomalee. Yeah. And you know when that went in,
Unknown Speaker 1:25:19
I was curious
Unknown Speaker 1:25:21
70s late 60s early 70s So I figured it was around.
Unknown Speaker 1:25:29
I lose track of time.
Unknown Speaker 1:25:30
It was also done in stages. Yeah. That was a good panel. Oh God, they weren't awful. They had the water system in there. So it's no CRD. Barney took it over. But it was an absolute nightmare. Jeff Holland built some water lines out of scraps. What was that while you're saying welders was tight and tight could be an after I quit selling real estate I worked for the North salt three water district until I retired. Okay. We were the only water district with a often Sena shop and the whole ball of wax because we were the only three big ones. There were several other small ones. But this was a private system up in Malibu. Well, it's happened to BAM when the first few people have bought in there. We're basically sort of local people are made up of all the idiosyncrasy. But then they started getting city people to come in there and the water system was an absolute disaster. Get the ball on laying waterline like he should and then he come with ease of fitting and connect put them together when he might not have the right size. So he dirty build something into them. And of course eventually it either didn't work or at least like people were always running out of water because the water tank was going dry. Well the water tank was going dry because there was so many many nobody has meters
Unknown Speaker 1:27:19
because water to get gone out of it and waters ended up looking after. And we would get all their phone calls because we were the only water district really listed in the phonebook. So I would try and find this. Bevis Walters Oh, yeah. I would try and find them as waters three quarters of the time he would never answer his phone or he would never hear and when I ever got older he say Well Mister so and so's looking after the system for me. Well, by the time I got the next call that Mr. COVID decided to get enough of this water system and Mr. Bevin so I call him and he say no, I'm not doing it anymore. It was just a fiasco. So one day I got a hold of them as long as there's been a couple of young women come over from the city with little kids. They did without water for two days. Now here I am trying to find a buyer I found when I just blew up, they brought me in and the new repairman. And he said to the repairman now you'll be sure in bigger flowers once in a while he said because she helps look after our system and I thought you all skinflint. You never bought me a bouquet of flowers that was that one was an absolute riot CRD where we spent three times with normal person would spend anyway because their government but they had to do so much repairs anyone just absolute show Marvel. The same guy used to go out there and do like three pairs like back home service, Charlie Byron would just fall in the tree for himself up north. But he was a real good backhoe operator. He used to do an awful lot of work for our districts. He also was that the was that Byron? Who was horseland What could have been opposite? Yeah. Howard? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, cuz I remember that. Just before Howard died. One of his sons. It didn't wasn't one of his sons that was killed. Yeah. Not that long ago.
Unknown Speaker 1:29:37
Five years. And a wagon. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:29:40
Because that's why, you know, we were talking about how dangerous my perception of logging is being very dangerous. I
Unknown Speaker 1:29:47
remember thinking was just a few years ago, this guy. Yeah. But when you said there weren't that many accidents on the island, there weren't there weren't. What about the Do you ever get involved with the milling of what's what's,
Unknown Speaker 1:30:05
what's kind of before we were involved in the terminal? I have my own little mill for a while. And what we milling for what kind of work? What kind of
Unknown Speaker 1:30:16
anything? So he was it a portable million took
Unknown Speaker 1:30:18
it to No, it was I ran it for six years with it, you know? Before I went Jack Webb, who bought the place, somebody invited him to tell me to get lost. And he did. And I did. And he had the come back, and I wouldn't. Why did he wants to come back? Because he realized he'd made a mistake, because he might want some lumber one day.
Unknown Speaker 1:30:43
Oh, I see. So is that when you stopped milling? So how long have you been off for
Unknown Speaker 1:30:49
six years? And I told mine equipment to one fella. And he resorted to Howard Horrell and Howard Horrell still has the military.
Unknown Speaker 1:31:03
I built it and got it running in 63. Just about the time I went to work on BC Ferries. Instead of becoming a business, it became a hobby actually didn't start out as a business, per se. It was it was more of a hobby than a business. But what was 63 and 69 instead of cabinet here, I thought all the lumber for that. Right.
Unknown Speaker 1:31:30
So we know your own word or other people's word as well.
Unknown Speaker 1:31:33
I did it both
Unknown Speaker 1:31:37
to when you when you were doing a lot of your logging in earlier days. With a lot of nose on the big meals.
Unknown Speaker 1:31:47
No, not big ones. No, there was never a real big Milan. Yeah. There were quite a few like the McAfee meltdown where Tim O'Donnell lives today. Was back. I don't know. There was at one point there was a dozen little meals off and on you know, they came and went by the maximum cap trigger when with McAfee, or McAfee was here in the 20s and he was here right evidently sold out in 46 I guess when
Unknown Speaker 1:32:22
I was emailing all that.
Unknown Speaker 1:32:24
Pretty much yeah, he had settings on mobile and Isabel no worries at all. But he ended up at his so played on the waterfront. He was going to Milla Rainbow Road. Under the power line in the corner roundwood he had a place right there in the corner, and he had a sawmill there when I was young.
Unknown Speaker 1:32:46
Now what about that big mill that one on Cushing called Bowman? Oh, that was years and years before
Unknown Speaker 1:32:52
that that was ever reactivated.
Unknown Speaker 1:32:58
And the timing of that you hear about that was earlier they were Florida. Yeah, it was it was a company called a singer singer company. So that was figures that we had
Unknown Speaker 1:33:09
I know my dad worked for them. Oh, yeah. They must have been fairly large though. Oh, no, no. Oh, I think it'll be and it was still when you say little things
Unknown Speaker 1:33:19
about how many people would would have worked in the single mill? Maybe three, three and each 123 People
Unknown Speaker 1:33:27
in the mail? Yeah. And then it was Father's and Buckers and horsemen. So they're all portable. Yeah. Very portable van. He didn't
Unknown Speaker 1:33:38
Yeah, whatever the day you pick it up.
Unknown Speaker 1:33:43
Yeah, in those days, you didn't throw them around on wheels. You took it apart. You took it apart when you got to where you were going. You found new trees and built the foundation for it and put the machinery on the foundation when you had a sawmill but that was considered portable
Unknown Speaker 1:34:03
so when you see when it was what kind of a foundation would they put it on?
Unknown Speaker 1:34:09
Yeah, I went to Lowe's rotted out there to move it underneath and started again if it stayed there that long. But usually they cut out a certain radius September and it was easier to move the mail and want to move loaves further than that. Down here where the horrible road is with a crater Park is it was a great huge sort of pile there when I was a kid and were to one Blackburn road back in the timber there across from the old Blackburn place towards divided hill with two or three sawdust piled in there. It was love them over here in the cranberry that were singers were filthy Brune had one up right road. It was one down here in the kitchen road. It was stupid thought it piles on Stewart road
Unknown Speaker 1:35:03
Valcourt came here in the 60s and they had affordable. unmake, they cut under a bus to set up in a dozen different places while they were in.
Unknown Speaker 1:35:17
Where are they not about course they've left. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:35:22
They built the Valcourt center.
Unknown Speaker 1:35:24
And they know, I know there's a lot of controversy over this. I'm not up to that point yet. I'm only up to 1900. I'm only up to 1900. Now, all hell, I'll
Unknown Speaker 1:35:33
show you this. But it's a lot of history to write about. But I'm looking forward to getting into the more current, the more modern more recent past. Because it sounds like it was quite a lively time here. Yeah, I think it's always been a lively time when there's silence. Yeah, well, it was always the Mason Dixon Line. Ghannouchi so where do you think you continue yourself to be on the forefront side here they are. Consider ourselves we are but you know what? That's true, right? You just just over don't
Unknown Speaker 1:36:13
know where to start. Where to record it both. Oh,
Unknown Speaker 1:36:18
hold on both and we're just thinking Brian was 537 buddies. 653 But the mount Maxwell Windsor line went all the way up to the bowl for just to say I don't know why we thought that was strange. Like the pannier he's he's flattered because that line went up there they brought the line from full fruit and it stopped the trailer park is is 653 years or is it it's sort of a matter of pride as to whether your lack of growth and
Unknown Speaker 1:37:00
if you want the Mason Dixon Line it's great to go Valley Road is where Ganges and corporate decorate. And it was a long Blackburn road. And up this side of Jack Webster's property over right road over to cranberry pretty close to Rogers
Unknown Speaker 1:37:21
court 5375 All the crown Brienna live three primaries and all of Blackburn roads is five three full front lines stops short of the trailer court all these are pointed out but 537 goes down a cushion late rode off the cranberry Blackburn road it would have been astronomical to to change that much line
Unknown Speaker 1:38:05
Why do you think there were never any really big Mills here? Wouldn't it have made sense I mean they were doing so much lobby What do you need to get the logs away by water? That
Unknown Speaker 1:38:17
was a lumber away when there's no boat
Unknown Speaker 1:38:20
to the ferry service corporate
Unknown Speaker 1:38:21
didn't start till 1930 Yeah, that was the first ferry and that was only a little thing it only holds 17 cars you couldn't do much with with no CPR boat came in four days a week once
Unknown Speaker 1:38:35
we brought a car on at the end of sling it off because it didn't have
Unknown Speaker 1:38:38
any sometimes I'll take any in the tide. Yeah, you could drive down the ramp inside of I wrote a car in Vancouver one time. But it was much easier to haul the loads away by water. That was a lumber by and there wasn't a trucks either.
Unknown Speaker 1:38:53
The one thing I find strange as I've seen I've seen a truck come on to the island recently. With with with with trees.
Unknown Speaker 1:39:01
Yeah. Okay, now that is when they're rolling on main island. Yeah. And the clacking do gooders I've got all the log dumps closed because of the impact on the environment. nonsens so they have to love our main island. loaded onto a truck. He's a ferry to Swartz Bay, come over to salt bring and take it to Burgoyne where's the only dump in the Gulf Islands. Oh, really all that cost money.
Unknown Speaker 1:39:29
doesn't really add a lot to the cost. They'll be wondering why we can't have affordable are they doing much Sure. Are you doing much loving on maintenance?
Unknown Speaker 1:39:38
Well, we're Grumman has been hauling logs from Maine to get stopping for a long time. And when Laurie hauling is was hauling, and Larry Cornell had a logging truck, they weren't Galliano to bring their main panda and all the Saltspring
Unknown Speaker 1:39:52
so you say they take it from Maine to Swartz Bay and then come over back over here on the board and so there's no there's no place to to to boom over there, the price
Unknown Speaker 1:40:03
is the same at Burgoyne Bay as it is in Victoria. So he can come from Maine Island. That duck around fourth Bay come to bring it home. Yeah. Where do we hold him to Victoria? He still gonna come back to talk to work and main island the next morning on long Harbor, but much simpler. They love to do the same price. And it gets away from that long haul into Victoria. Like coming to corporate and so he mean he goes back to Maine on the longer buffet. Yeah, in the morning. Most crock a lot of money
Unknown Speaker 1:40:37
to put one of those big trucks because I remember even when we moved here I mean the movie the moving truck would cost a lot of money. Well, they decided that all these lockdown depart from the lockdown would kill all the shellfish and kill all the crabs and kill everything else that came in those days. And one of the daughters who unfortunately died of the people on provoke was a marine biologist. That's what she studied. Kids are really smart. She went into her me marine biology her daughter who another daughter. Oh, yeah, who cares for her for Oh, I see. I only know that I only knew there were three. The other ones dead. And she did a study in the Gulf Islands to see because he was dumping Lawson for both places for years. Yeah. And she says that where those logs the log dumps were was the best marine things going really? It hadn't happened the crabs that hadn't Halford anything in the way of maybe protected them could be what she say it did under the boom Yeah. They get in under the boom safe
Unknown Speaker 1:41:57
One girl said to me one day when they wanted to start a new booming groaning Fulford harbour Oh, he's gonna be kind of adhesives apart from the love of Kilala craft. And he was a little longer. I said, now just a minute. How come the logs apart from these logs will kill crabs? When the bark Marlin low you put in the baby didn't? That was the end of it. Never said that again.
Unknown Speaker 1:42:22
Everybody has a different idea. I barely get out of your hair. You probably weren't last night here. You're not gonna you're not getting hungry.
Unknown Speaker 1:42:28
I say you're not in my hair. Coffee you're
Unknown Speaker 1:42:33
either one of you have retros I mean, I'm I'm quite free. So I'm the I don't
Unknown Speaker 1:42:40
eat lunch. How do you have you feel like you're here to go. Work at all. I know. It's interesting.
Unknown Speaker 1:42:52
To to have a big breakfast and a big breakfast.
Unknown Speaker 1:42:57
I have trouble keeping it under check. I try to do
Unknown Speaker 1:43:01
it too. But I believe I have trouble too. But I believe you're just a kid. Yes. I'm just a kid. So my kids that live on my arm 5252
Unknown Speaker 1:43:15
Yeah. Our daughter 52 next month. Oh, really? Is that is that Carol or no? No, she's the older one had autumn pattern by recovering Where's where's the bakery? Where the old folks
Unknown Speaker 1:43:35
live there. Oh, okay. Yeah, that's our daughter. Oh, I
Unknown Speaker 1:43:39
think he works for Dr. Burke. Oh, I
Unknown Speaker 1:43:42
think your receptionist Karen Berg. So what's the difference in age between between her and Carol?
Unknown Speaker 1:43:50
Carol will be Pete Carroll was born in 51. They were born in 45. Or 46. Carol will be 46. And then there's one younger than Carol. Recording by November.
Unknown Speaker 1:44:15
See now I have a few few questions here. See if any of these things you can answer. Some of these are very old questions.
Unknown Speaker 1:44:31
Know a fella named Ted Parsons. What was his? He went into business with his stepfather Tony Fletcher. You remember a fella named Fletcher? His stepfather named Fletcher.
Unknown Speaker 1:44:51
Ted Parsons.
Unknown Speaker 1:44:52
Yeah. Ted Parsons. He
Unknown Speaker 1:44:53
was a chicken. Yeah. And for when he first went into business he was when he was in partnership. Would you step farther? I have no idea. You never heard of a man named Fletcher. Related to the only Fletcher I knew on the item was their cataloger. Alright. And that was in the 30s. Okay. But the the Parsons boys were all older than me. Gordon Parsons still lives along harbor road.
Unknown Speaker 1:45:22
There was a startup startup
Unknown Speaker 1:45:30
Parsons had a chicken farm. Yeah. When I remember.
Unknown Speaker 1:45:36
There was quite a big, big tip. Oh,
Unknown Speaker 1:45:38
yes. Oh, yes, yes. They bought their feet great from Vancouver came by Commons to corporate dock and Ganges. And they had their own truck to haul it home. Oh, yeah. They were a big producer. And they shipped eggs to Vancouver.
Unknown Speaker 1:45:52
They your sister Evelyn. She's married to Alia Runnymede. Now, Ronnie. Firstly was Edward Lee. The one that was running these father grandfather.
Unknown Speaker 1:46:08
Running grandfather was known as Old tomley.
Unknown Speaker 1:46:10
Currently, was he firstly on the island?
Unknown Speaker 1:46:13
No. No, I don't think so. They go back a long, long ways.
Unknown Speaker 1:46:22
I've had trouble finding out information about lease, or here. And there. I've got Edward Lee 1887. I've got Edward Lee moves onto a belt of property spanning the burgeron Valley from Musgrave mountain to below the horrible property.
Unknown Speaker 1:46:42
What you're looking at 718 87 After what the time Ronnie lead father was born.
Unknown Speaker 1:46:51
So this Edward Lee must have been Oh, it could have been his grandfather could have been how old would run we'd be
Unknown Speaker 1:46:59
running 88 Wow.
Unknown Speaker 1:47:05
88 or something, told me he's not well, I
Unknown Speaker 1:47:09
was getting old.
Unknown Speaker 1:47:16
When you're at age,
Unknown Speaker 1:47:19
he was in a very bad car accident and statue and several years ago. And they said if he hadn't been so healthy and so wired and so strong, that he should have diagnosed and never survived. And that's really not.
Unknown Speaker 1:47:33
He went out to the right hand open window. They were driving us out through the window and out through the open window on the right side of the car getting roadside, he went out to the open window.
Unknown Speaker 1:47:47
So he must be he must be good enough request moment. He is smaller, he can't even imagine sitting through when he did only went through it when he shot and then the car turned over. It was partially on him.
Unknown Speaker 1:48:02
This was in 78 I think it was in or two.
Unknown Speaker 1:48:08
She was when she brought the hurt. Didn't know. He stayed in the car for the conference. Sort of the car protected her. Well. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:48:19
So was he able to work accident? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. He retired not too long after. So what did what did he do? Running he would he owned the shell service again. He had a shop where Patterson store is today. When he came back from the army in 45. There was no fella had a blacksmith shop repair shop there and Ronnie took that over. And he worked there until he moved to Shell service in January was that that guy that the blacksmith shop was at McAfee? No, no. That would cut a lot Cudmore aren't cut my heart couldn't Cudmore you know, Gordon's Uncle, uncle? No, McAfee convexity sharp is where the gasoline Alley is. Yeah, that was that was another McAfee McAfee also had a sawmill when they were two different Bill McAfee's.
Unknown Speaker 1:49:13
Totally unrelated spelling in English.
Unknown Speaker 1:49:17
Yeah, yep. MC a FF e to that they were both Bill McCabe's and there were no relation whatsoever.
Unknown Speaker 1:49:30
Now there's Edward Lee, who took up that land in 1887 had to be Hudson least bothered.
Unknown Speaker 1:49:39
So Huxley was wrong and
Unknown Speaker 1:49:46
now this Edward Lee, I think he married a native woman. But right now there were several leads it was within the more Are there were several reasons.
Unknown Speaker 1:50:02
The Idle go back to running grandfather. I saw them on one I think in my life, but these are the leaves of litella.
Unknown Speaker 1:50:13
Family they are. Ronnie's father had several brothers. And there was another family of Lee's two who had property down there. Hudson Edley would run his father cousins. It was another one. Newcomb. Lee was Ronnie's father and brother. And there were several other people around. I don't know who the father was. Ed Lee who was running. I don't know who his father was. You know, where the Brigden where the old barn fell down in the snow here that winter across the holiday called the holly farm.
Unknown Speaker 1:51:06
Oh, yeah. Okay. Well, Hudson
Unknown Speaker 1:51:08
Headley, who would run a dead cousin on the far end he hung himself in his barn in 1936. I never knew him. Every
Unknown Speaker 1:51:25
Ronnie's father's name was Jack. John constantly on the phone with it. And because old Tom Lee Hudson is a fever family named somehow Hudson and in most of their days, so they called Ronnie's broader Hudson Tom to differentially from oxnead. And I don't know if either works in Hudson in their name Irani name is Ronald Hudson Lee Hudson is a family named
Unknown Speaker 1:52:04
confusing that I don't even have a tree isn't real math. Ronnie mentioned this one on that one over the years. And I never sorted out which I've never seen a family tree for the least
Unknown Speaker 1:52:20
in the foolproof in in the viewfinder. There's a picture of a new complete entertainment Barrow booming, logged in appropriate harbor in 1914. While the newcomer Lee was there with a frightful and a quart golf trousers with Ronnie's dad's cousin. His name was new complete. Now somewhere along the line, he belonged to the place that Brigden is on now. Where the barn fell down. But I don't know who his father was. I have no idea. And because the Hudson will have family name, the OH GOD tag HUD Hudson, and their name. Edward Lee.
Unknown Speaker 1:53:10
He seems to have been quite a quite a major farmer and fruit grower equivalent quantity of orchard.
Unknown Speaker 1:53:20
Well, that would have been
Unknown Speaker 1:53:22
there's quite an old orchard isn't there on here. Well, that
Unknown Speaker 1:53:24
would have been running grandfather. Yeah. That's what I thought. But everybody called him Old probably. Yeah, I've never heard of him referred to as inwardly he was always Oh, totally.
Unknown Speaker 1:53:41
But Edward Lee was not a holy farm. There was a big orchard on that farm too. And that was a farm. Also.
Unknown Speaker 1:53:48
Give it that was Hudson. Food. Elmers. Father, yeah, Ronnie's dad. Yeah, he was a different.
Unknown Speaker 1:53:55
He was a different brand. He's the one he said hanged himself in this branch right there and he on the whole
Unknown Speaker 1:54:01
he did. Yeah, that was probably, I don't know, I know. I
Unknown Speaker 1:54:07
know who's there. This Nancy Braithwaite thing about her. Her customers there. But he wrecks it. Yeah. Malcolm pant.
Unknown Speaker 1:54:18
We wouldn't know.
Unknown Speaker 1:54:19
I don't. I don't know who owns it. For years now. It's possible, you know, he may he may be waiting for a day on a lot of
Unknown Speaker 1:54:32
land. Data Logging might be right. If they still do I don't know.
Unknown Speaker 1:54:37
Oh, yeah. I don't think they sell their land. They don't know they hold on. We just didn't just bought that. Well. That's interesting. They're very clever company
Unknown Speaker 1:54:48
that I have never heard Ron a grandfather referred to as Edward Lee. He was always struggling.
Unknown Speaker 1:54:57
Well, you know, I think I Think? I'm not sure, but I think I remember the initials. Ely. So Edward could have been a second name I may have, I might have it wrong here. And I have to check
Unknown Speaker 1:55:20
what a grandfather's name really was?
Unknown Speaker 1:55:22
Do you have that? You have a copy of that I didn't bring that old Wilson 1895 conflict that the Historical Society reproduced. Because if it had names of all the old farmers in 1885, and this guy was in there.
Unknown Speaker 1:55:44
I can't remember how your first I tried to mark all this all this down? Yeah, it's one of the things that I believe you could you could if you had the game to do it. I can see. This is where the books going. The timeline, put all the grandfather mistakes in there. But I want to find out where Tom Lee joining. Yeah. And he'll check with various people. Okay, who
Unknown Speaker 1:56:20
were then we've
Unknown Speaker 1:56:22
been sort of marking things down as I get the information. I'm actually using this quite a lot of material. Because you're already in the book. Are you ready to book
Unknown Speaker 1:56:33
your interviewing if needed. We're all a family, we came across Edward Lee owns land on this hill and down into the valley. That would have been well, we knew with Tom Lee, who would run a grandfather.
Unknown Speaker 1:57:00
It's really fascinating going to call this history. I find it really interesting because I haven't been here very long, a chance of getting in touch with the place.
Unknown Speaker 1:57:13
And he was a cousin to running flutter.
Unknown Speaker 1:57:16
I always found it interesting wherever I've lived, just trying to figure out who's been there before, and how it all Tama touched. Because otherwise you don't really
Unknown Speaker 1:57:30
want to keep on coming. I'd love
Unknown Speaker 1:57:31
to go. Right now he's back again. Probably an American company, but he's over in the Middle East. And he's been to Japan, all kinds of places. And he always fits in and he always gets along with the people. Because He's genuinely interested in their history. Now. He doesn't go there and say, Well, you don't want to American withdrawal of money. Was it all the idea? You know, I'm Canadian anyway, but he is genuinely interested. And people talk to him. Tell him history and reverie goals and just get along. Because he ended up he finds out about their history. Because he said well, you know, that's what makes it interesting. Oh, yeah. Talk to them. I know what their history is all sorts of places and they just love it. And the history everywhere is really interesting. Well, sure. I mean, wherever you have people you have interesting
Unknown Speaker 1:58:41
when I came here, your store was just about worthy information. chamber commerce that was in the 44th. Street and they were for
Unknown Speaker 1:59:06
me, I have to name Edward Leakey. And when they really I always wear they weren't out all the farms for they ended up there. What was your grandfather's name your dad's father, totally. Thomas Hudson. And your father was spruced it up a bit. So it's the same building that exists only for sure. Okay. Remember your mother used to call him Jack and your grandfather I think it was married is a bird to come from England
Unknown Speaker 1:59:55
maternity store was
Unknown Speaker 1:59:57
a place I couldn't find a whole lot of information about But we're trying to and then it seems to me you're a returner Wasn't she involved in something else from
Unknown Speaker 2:00:13
Maggie Fulford in or something
Unknown Speaker 2:00:22
so much information in there that it's getting confusing but it was some
Unknown Speaker 2:00:39
they were brothers okay then Maggie from the public came up with them I got you and his name was Edward
Unknown Speaker 2:00:51
turn it on I turned it off and I never knew if he was might involve that's one way to find out oh yeah oh yeah a long time back there were a lot of private school I don't know. I can't remember my mother and sisters and brothers names but we never knew them. Yeah, that Newcomb was a he was a cousin to your father your brother picture in the property and have a new complete will be logged with him experiment 1914 and he will your dad's cousin. Okie dokie Britain
Unknown Speaker 2:01:44
1906 brought the kids learning further to heal from from someone I shouldn't wreck where I got information from. Okay.