Salt Spring Island Archives
| Accession Number | |||
| Date | 2004 | ||
| Media | digital recording | Audio | mp3 √ |
| duration | 74 minutes |
315_Charles-Kahn_9-04-2013.mp3
otter.ai
11.03.2024
no
Outline
Speaker 1 0:00
I proceed to that extent you have been already yes
Unknown Speaker 0:06
okay this one here we have to
Unknown Speaker 0:14
yeah I guess what is this one you know why don't you know to
Speaker 2 0:17
do that and then I can just concentrate on talking okay
Unknown Speaker 0:24
if we go too fast
Speaker 3 0:28
oh you know integrated one to nine basically what I'm doing so
Speaker 2 0:36
this is what I did I knew the numbers but I think you have changed the numbers a couple of times what 50 flops but I basically what I just wanted to do is I want to move that one over here
Speaker 4 0:52
yes because this one here resume is love yeah
Unknown Speaker 1:01
yeah
Unknown Speaker 1:08
I think it's been court for
Unknown Speaker 1:14
look here this is the same
Speaker 4 1:20
look very very similar but
Unknown Speaker 1:28
yeah
Unknown Speaker 1:31
yours is to deceive yes or no yeah, you will want the same thing
Speaker 3 1:44
what else before we left this one well I didn't realize that we only had these two are the receivers this one is somebody
Unknown Speaker 1:58
who would just skim over it at one time I
Unknown Speaker 2:04
could love it for one second and we can just do it
Speaker 4 2:12
okay, well in that case I was going to use it to the computer maybe where should Where should I sit with the computer?
Unknown Speaker 2:27
I didn't know you're gonna have a computer on your lap or maybe
Unknown Speaker 2:31
he or she
Unknown Speaker 2:41
didn't know you didn't want to do it himself and we'll put that one over here
Unknown Speaker 2:51
you won't be able to watch Can you reach it?
Unknown Speaker 2:55
I should have brought my table along but
Unknown Speaker 3:00
you want me to do it if you're not at me Have you got a remote?
Unknown Speaker 3:03
I kind of remote to
Unknown Speaker 3:12
just want to hear
Unknown Speaker 3:20
news
Unknown Speaker 3:29
what am I watching right now without showing
Unknown Speaker 3:55
up is free
Unknown Speaker 4:09
services
Unknown Speaker 4:22
there
Unknown Speaker 4:27
we're just getting started
Unknown Speaker 4:42
I'm Dr. Phil Well, Frank was working with a
Unknown Speaker 4:59
projector Hi
Unknown Speaker 5:19
guys right
Unknown Speaker 5:42
out
Unknown Speaker 5:49
this is actually Ray Charles
Unknown Speaker 6:13
Bucha Good afternoon like to call our meeting to order
Unknown Speaker 6:26
Nice to see you all out the new chairs don't fall asleep. Last meeting was held on in February or February meeting, we had the Treasurer's Report which we'll get one in a minute. Brief Overview was given of the library and the new archives. The new library or the archive hours are Monday, one to three, Wednesday tend to to Thursday tend to to and by appointment. And the archives, as you all know are located on the second floor of the new library. Our program the last meeting was Linda England talking about our carousel talking about her family history on Salt Spring. And today we have Charles coming to talk to us about trends and popery of salt spray the history, I call it history of Ganges. But if you're here for the history of Ganges, you may not get that. He said his gazes will be mentioned, but he's talking more about the broader trends of some of the Saltspring. History. So he'll be on just a few minutes. So if you're here for Ganges history, you can leave now. Thank you, Duncan, I will give us a quick overview of our finances, please.
Speaker 1 7:46
High, we're doing quite well, I think the grand total in the accounts at the moment is 13,778. That's been augmented by a couple of things, a $5,000 gaming grants to help society run. And it involves quite a bit of money from the IK Barbara foundation to do to do very specifically to find archiving work. So that money is has to be spent on that which is almost 5000. But as you've probably know, the the we're now paying for insurance, and the rent in this building is going up. And the rent at the library is now in place. So while we're comfortably well off, we're not totally rich. And I'd like to thank everyone for their contributions to the Legacy Fund, which is now about $3,600 total.
Unknown Speaker 8:42
Thanks Duncan. Duncan mentioned about our finances. We have two groups. We have the salt three Historical Society, which is this group here. And we have the archives, which is some of this group, but it's also an operation that operates independently, but it's sponsored by the Salisbury Historical Society. And having said that, they have all the money because it's all grant money. Basically, the society just depends on membership fees, and donations, and we pay our way. Well, in the last two years, we've had to put liability insurance on our meetings, and also on our contents in in our activities in the archives, which costs us in the neighborhood of $600 a year, which we have been covering out of our general revenue. So for the past few years, because we've had a little bit of a surplus there. In the art in the psaltery historical society itself. We have about $1,250, probably up to 13,000, about 10% of it. So I'm sort of setting you up here for something. A fee increase. We rent is going up at this particular facility starting in September. Our insurance will continue on our expenses of meetings and the advertising and any expenses we have when we bring people we had to who require very fair. So the directors of the meeting will have the society Historical Society will present an emotion at our May meeting, which is our AGM meeting, that the fee for next year in subsequent years, quarter $20. We can talk about that at that meeting. But this is sort of a notice of motion, that that's the direction we're heading in. So it'd be it. If it passes a $20 annual fee. We're sorry, we have to do that. And we're like everybody else, we haven't increased our fee for a long time. And now we have to do it. So be forewarned, that's what's going to happen. And speaking of that, if you're really violently opposed to the fee increase, we do need some directors to run for positions on our executive for the next year. So if you would like to stand up, and give us your name, we'll make sure you're elected. And you can come through our meetings. And we'll keep the fee as it is, we do need directors more than we need the fee increase probably in the long run. But speaking of that, our program for next year is we need your support and help. If you have any ideas have program topics you would like to see us try and present. If you leave your name at the back or topic at the back or phone me or email me or talk to one of the executive members and say, Have you thought of doing this or thought of doing that? Because it's hard to continually come up with ideas. And we want programs that reflect the history of Saltspring as much as possible. And we've done a lot of them. But 190 programs on Saltspring history over the years, we have most of them on tape, we have all of them in our archives. And you can go online and see them and listen to them or review them if you want. But it does get difficult because we start to overlap of course, and duplicate. So we have had lots of excellent programs with the families of Saltspring in their history, and the events of psaltery in Ireland. So we relate to continue to do that. In our at our AGM meeting next. I think it's made the 10 second Wednesday of May, we have Patrick Taylor coming to talk to us who is who is the author of the English country doctor, I believe it is. But he's coming to talk to us about some of the his growing up in Ireland, some of his trends of history in Ireland and so on. So he's a very interesting speaker, and I'm sure you'll want to come and hear him. He's very humorous. Very good, very professional. And that'll be in our main meeting. So without any further ado, I'll have somebody who adjourn this meeting. Hands up who wants to meet during the meeting? Thank you, Donna. Got it up first. And I'll introduce our program. Are you ready, Charles? Yeah, Charles is coming forward. And he's going to Charles Kahn is a historian on the island has written an excellent history of Salt Spring. He's been a longtime resident, and he's been very active in the archives, very active in our society. And he has agreed to come forward this afternoon and give us an overview of some of the trends and topics have happened in salt rain over the last few years. I heard his presentation earlier this year, and I liked it. And I asked him to come forward. So Charles, thank you for agreeing to do this. Thanks very much.
Speaker 2 13:25
I help this, I think this is on, isn't it, I can hear me. So I didn't do a similar talk to this earlier. And some of you were there. I felt a little badly about repeating. So I've made some changes. I hope it's better. But as Bob said, there's a lot of overlap in this society. And I am one of the people who overlaps more than others perhaps being a generalist. Also, I like to point out that this is not my history. There are a lot of people in this audience whose history it is. And I encourage you to correct me, interrupt me add some stories of your own, because that's what makes this presentation really good. My bare bones stuff is just the beginning. So feel free to add your own flavor to the talk. Don't wait for the end. You can do it. You can do it as it goes. So I thought I'd start at the at the beginning which which is before Saltspring was settled by non Aboriginal people. Aboriginal people were the first human residence on the island. And there's more than 130 climb mountains that show their their evidence. And this gives you an idea of you know, where the mountains are. They're all around was interesting. I found this on the Archives website. And I remember when I wanted to use this map in my in my book, The Ministry of something or other Aboriginal Affairs or something got really upset about it, and they wouldn't let me know And I thought it was going to have a little bit of a war about it. In the end, I didn't use it. But now I see it's on the website. So I figured it was okay to show it to you. Go ahead. So this is an indication of one of the middens that you'll see. I think this must have been from a dig, maybe the one in long Harbor, Walker Walker Hill. And you can see how what they did was they harvested shells, and just left them there. And they built up over over millennia. And and then you get these these mittens. Reverend Wilson, who came to the island at 95 felt that the mittens proved that the Aboriginal peoples visiting Saltspring for 1000s of years. And here's a quote from from one of his publications 20 years or so ago, it was no strange thing during the months of May or June. I'm just going to turn that flashlight on. There we go. To see the shores of Ganges harmed or swarming with Indians 500 or more in number, their long curiously shaped canoes drawn up on the beach, the object of their visit being to dig roast and preserve the clam fish that these visits must have been made by in the same spot for centuries past as evidenced by the great depth of the clamshell soil, three four even in places as much as seven feet in depth with trees 200 years old or more growing in it, indeed the theory up and that's so that's that's what he observed. He also went on to talk about how the natives here had things that they traded with natives in in in the in the prairies, for the the shellfish that they harvested and dried here here on the west coast. So the main Aboriginal settlements were in Fulford harbour Ganges, long harbor and Hudson point. There were first nations people living on the South Indian reserve at Fulford harbour until the 1920s. So this, this is a picture of the reserve. Most of you probably know it, it's a lovely place to walk. And this is a picture of were told, I wasn't there. So I don't know that this is Charlie, fellow who has the same name as me, ironically, interestingly, and he was the last native person to live on the reserve. And he has a very interesting story. He was saving up for a Potlatch. And I think the story is told in B Hamilton's book, it's apocryphal, so I didn't include it in my book. But B Hamilton was a much more interesting writer, and she included all kinds of interesting stories. Some of them are not necessarily accurate, but they're very fun to read. Anyway, apparently he was saving up for a Potlatch and then he disappeared and all the money that he had saved up and all the things he had collected for the Potlatch disappeared. And I think they found his canoe but I don't know that they ever found his body. And they were not quite sure he and his wife both disappeared. Do we know that that is what? We don't know that that's his way. This picture was provided to the archives sometime after I finished my book. So I wasn't able to use this in my book. But we think that that is Charlie. That's what we're told. Gordon Cudmore found several petroglyphs in Fulford Harbour. One of these was installed in Drummond Park by Ray and Beth and Ray Hill who did quite a bit of research on petroglyphs. Gordon told me that he had found many of them. And he told me that if I wanted to go looking at a low tide, preferably in the summer, when the tides get very low, that they were still there. I never did take him up on that. They're apparently in the harbor quite far out. And they're probably if they do if they do still exist it probably down in the mud right now. But he claimed that there were a lot of them their game was going right on and now these are the canoes that they use. And these were the canoes that first non Aboriginal people who came to settle here used to bring their things. They would often hire native people to help them bring their things and these were very seaworthy boats. This picture isn't from Saltspring. So these are the Salish canoes. Now non native Oh, we have one picture. Yes, of native woman. So one of the things that people did when they came here, there were a lot of native people who who lived here possibly part time, possibly full time. They they weren't too happy to see all these non native people coming in kind of taking their land. And when first people came here, first non native people. They came here with permission of of Governor Doug I was but he wasn't all that keen about it because he didn't have treaties in place with the native people. But he allowed them to settle on the land. And in some cases, the native people were quite hostile because basically these people were taking their land. So one of the things that, that these the, the some of the a lot of a lot of the people who came and settled here did was they married native women, because mostly they were single men who came here, and they often didn't have wives anyway, women were hard to find. And it's very hard to have a household with just one party and we can talk about that some more later, because there's some other interesting marriages that took place so they would marry a native woman. And by marrying a native woman, they became part native or their families became part native, and they were much, much more welcomed. So here's a quote from Margaret Shaw, Walter, who settled first on Galliano and then moved to Saltspring. She says these native wives adapted themselves in a surprising degree to the white man's ways, learning also to speak English more or less. One thing seemed curious in this direction, the mothers often spoke to their to the children in her own tongue, but the youngsters invariably answered, in English, at least those we knew did. And while these wives might be docile, this did not mean subservient. Should conditions become too uncomfortable, there was always the tribal reserve to fall back on, and how they had to choose between seeking them out there, or having his domestic arrangements put out of gear. This used to amuse my mother, who thought they were more independent in various ways than their white sisters. But such disagreement seemed to happen seldom and the union was as a rule kept loyally on both sides. As time went on, they might be moved or persuaded to marry legally. And one of such events we knew of took place when the father and mother were married, and their grandchild christened on the same day. Among the first nine native settlers were a number of black people that came from California. Unlike some, they settled mainly in the north end of the island in Vesuvius and Central, and they were active community members. So this is Howard Estes. He arrived on Saltspring in 1860. He'd worked in the gold mines of California to earn money to buy himself out of slavery in Missouri, as these came with his daughter, Sylvia and her husband, Louis Stark. So this is Sylvia Stark, born in Missouri in 1839. She died in 1944, at the age of 105. Although Nobody's really sure exactly how it was us. None of these black people were slaves. Some books say they were slaves, and that there was a black colony here on the island. That's apocryphal too, it's not true. Governor Douglas did not want a black colony on Saltspring. Island. And he, they did ask for a colony, they did want a place where it would all be black people together. And half of the people who first came to Saltspring in 1859, were black. But it wasn't the black colony. So that's, that's inaccurate. Now, you can go on.
Speaker 2 23:13
One of the reasons I want these pictures include these pictures are Central School, this is Central School in 1908, is to show you the diversity of people. There was a much greater diversity of people in Salisbury back then, than there is today. Although I think probably has more diversity now than when I came to the island 20 years ago. But it's interesting. You see the Japanese, the blacks, it's hard to find a white person in that picture. And this was in Central, well here, right where we are, the school was on this property. So this is the second one is 1929. And then this is the inside of the school and I thought this is kind of fun, because I can remember having a desk when I was a kid didn't look all that different from these, which may be kind of scary actually. And you realize how old you're getting. But there are a few faces here I recognize who are about my age, so right so this is the Central School. Other early immigrants included Japanese who were first brought to the island to help clear and land to work on the farms, and Hawaiians known as Connexus, who originally came to Canada as employees of the Hudson's Bay Company. They settled on Saltspring when the Hudson's Bay contract, company contracts were completed. Unlike the black settlers who lived mainly at the CVS most of the connections lived in Fulford and were involved in building St. Paul's Catholic Church. So we've we on the close ups now and we've got past the church. Yeah, there's the here's the church. Franklin got the close up. So you can see the people in greater detail. But this was the original church and you can see it I think it looks a lot better than the current church with its facing. But I don't know, there may be people that disagree. And I shouldn't say things like that, because I might get myself in trouble. But actually was interesting. We were where we were, we were looking at the, the museum in Victoria. And somebody put some awful facing on that sometime was I thought it was wonderful, and possibly in the 50s or 60s. I think it would be nice if they changed that too. Anyway, but you can see again, you know, the diversity of people, while they're mostly mostly Hawaiians, but you know, you just don't see pictures like this today. We're very whitebread here on Saltspring. We know that was a what might have been actually do we know? I thought we don't we don't actually know if it was a wedding. I always thought it was when they consecrated the church.
Speaker 1 26:04
My family has done a lot of research on that. And she's convinced that cannot be consecration division, which is most likely a multiple picture can be dated because there's a bell in the steeple. And when they repaired the church, so the date on the belt 1887 which is after the church.
Speaker 2 26:25
There was something in the driftwood when when Emily was doing Yeah, yeah, I remember that.
Unknown Speaker 26:29
It's good when she made those things are
Speaker 2 26:34
this is the kind of thing we should be debating on Salisbury. Okay, and then the story of the church is kind of interesting. It was consecrated on May 10th 1885. As a first cat first to church on the island, the oldest church. The five acres of land for the church were donated by Howard, Horace John Shepard, who was not a Catholic himself. The lumber for the building was brought from couch and by dugout canoe to Burgoyne Bay, and then by ox drawn stone boat through the fourth ribbon Valley. And this is this is a stone boat. I had a pointer here, but I think I've lost it. Oh, no, here it is. I thought maybe I'd lost your pointer. Yeah, so this is the stone boat here. And they brought a lot of things from from the water knowing what was known as the butter church. Many of you probably seen the butter Church on the it's on the reserve in Cowichan. And it's quite a neat building. It's still reasonably intact, the walls are anyway, the roof is getting a little real, you know, and inside it's kind of derelict. But it's kind of interesting to think that that was it's something like going to see one of these old churches in England, you know that, but they're still functioning but this one isn't. But it's built with the same kind of materials big big stone, big stones and they took the materials from that church. Let me read you this quote. The Windows including one stained glass window the door and the Bell came from the dismantle stone church near couch and Bay known as the butter church because the proceeds of butter sales from fallen Father Peter Rondo's farm had partly paid for it. For this reason, people often said that the Catholic Church at Fulford had been built by robbing Peter to pay to buy to pay Paul. So this, this is the way they brought their supplies by stone vote. Now we'll get on to transportation. I've kind of divided this up into sections, you know, early settlement people came. It's not it's not by any means all inclusive, it's just a sampling. So early transportation in Saltspring was difficult. For many years, there were no roads and only a few footpaths. People settled along the coast and traveled by robots not unlike this one shown in Booth canal in about 1911. People thought nothing of rowing 15 to 20 miles a day with boats full of goods. Friend of mine, Phil Grange apparently owns this boat. And apparently it this boat had belonged to moe, it's sort of you know that. You don't know that. Anyway, according to Phil, this book belongs to mullets. And he somehow has acquired it in its in his what he calls his boat shed being renovated for the second time. But I thought that was an interesting interesting story. So I throw it in
Speaker 2 29:40
Weren't they beautiful? Yeah, yeah, they lovely boats. We have then here's another one. And you can see the way people dressed in those days too. I can't imagine doing something like this dressed like that. I mean, I'm not expecially dressed up now, but I'm dressed up compared to the way I usually look at Because I'm standing in front of a bunch of people but but imagine just going rowing with hats and suits and stuff like that. So here's here's a story about in 1910 Curl Simon's, I'm not sure if he got his first name right. The teacher at Beaver point school couldn't get his wife to the doctor by road when she was in labor. He had no alternative but to roll her to the bed is home where Emily bed has helped deliver the baby. Simon says account of his return home is a good indication of the problems that travelers faced. The return home in December was in its way an odyssey. It was a bad day very wet, and with a rising wind Mrs. betta sauce into a small rowboat, I had borrowed, hot bricks were put on the floor and a shapeless bundle of rugs etc. That was my family was installed in the back. We wrote to the Bowman sawmill in Cushing Cove. So there's the bush, the Bowman sawmill, and those of you who read the book that I wrote with Chris Hatfield, know the story about the big mill down there. And this is when it was in its heyday. Now no more he says because he's written this book several years later, where the foreman boosted them up a ladder a steep ladder to a little cottage here a short rest and some hot cocoa did wonders. The next step was to board the old steamer Iroquois, which not long afterwards, was lost with many good lives. On it we reached beaver point worth in a gale and dilute and Delage here another good friend still my good friend, Mr. ruckle, lent us a horse and buggy and we drove home, avoiding falling branches with more luck than skill there and Mrs. Monk had a nice fire going and took charge while I drove the carriage back in pitch darkness, finally returning to a little scene, which I can only leave you to imagine. So here's this this fellow who actually So did he start that School in Victoria? Solomon's? Yeah. Yeah. So he, he started that School in Victoria, and he's quite a sophisticated person and he's living in, you know, in remote area near Rocco Park. He's probably in a little cabin that he was renting from from Henry ruckle. And you're having to travel in this way that I've just read, to have his to, for his wife to have a baby and then to get the baby back. It's amazing that they survived. And yet they did, didn't they? So this is the Iroquois law. This is the Iroquois arriving in Ganges it had it had a checkered career. You can see in this talk, I jumped from one thing to another you see do it but this is still transportation. So it's and Sue knows this very well because this is originally Sue gave a talk on on boats and a lot of this is Sue's original pictures. So this is 1907 was owned and operated by Captain a series that served the Gulf Islands from 1901 to 1911. When it sank off Sydney in stormy weather, it was very, very close to shore. Everybody could see it, but they couldn't do anything about it. They couldn't get to it and I quite a few people drowned. 20 passengers and crew drowned. Fewer from Saltspring the vessel was overloaded, and Captain Sears was indicted for manslaughter and lost his license. Somehow living on an island always brings us back to boats. We have ferries today in lots of ways for boats DeLanda the first settlers had no docks and few boats. So here are some of the boats that were very important on the island. This one's called an app the launch was owned by Frank and Jeff Scott, and was used near their near their from their wharf on Fruitvale. On Long harbor Road, about 1896 This is when possible they raise sales on both canoes and robots to make them faster and easier and more efficient. And everything had to be transported off the island by by boats and these these people were more upscale and in many because there were a lot of people who just had robots to take their their fruit, mostly fruit off the island. So this is the Fruitvale worth at 96. We just flipped through the next few This is the mod which was steamer owned by the Canadian Pacific Navigation Company from 1883. The mod sale the east coast of Vancouver Island and the Fraser River. And this is the Amelia at Vesuvius worth about 1889 This small boat was owned by Captain Butler, who took passengers from Victoria to Vesuvius. The boats went down the two suicides of Saltspring between Victoria and Nanaimo and The at the beginning when people first came here, there were no words so they had to roll out to these boats if they wanted to go to Victoria and Nanaimo or if they wanted to pick up goods that were being brought in. Eventually these words were built. So which one are we at now? The full fair game Fulford harbour worth built in 1891
Unknown Speaker 35:24
Yeah
Unknown Speaker 35:28
the mod was in Nanaimo yeah okay
Speaker 2 35:36
this one I think this is the JONES Yeah the Joan at Fulford dock and but at 95 This is one of the first boats to regularly visit the island. Okay, next one's one of my favorites. I like this picture because it says a lot Tom. This would have been probably on both days and mail was brought in and people were coming down to the docks. Again, you can see how formally dressed everybody is why I remember even when my dad moved to Saltspring he still wore he still wore it he still wore a jacket and often patiently a tie. I think eventually I got him out of the tie but he still had the white shirt. I don't think I own a white shirt. Yes, so this is kind of interesting with Molad store nearby Ganges was the main center on the island. Islanders congregated on the wharf to meet the boats bringing the mail and necessities from a late summer by er Cartwright. This is the quote from Cartwright. On both days we congregated at Ganges worth to meet the boat, supposedly to get the mail but actually on the chance of getting the Purser SS Iroquois to relent to open the bar and let us have a drink. The said person when he was feeling his best might even be persuaded to part with a bottle of whiskey. Okay, so this shows you more which store I have to I have to be careful how I point this out because I could destroy myself. That's the store they are the original store and the sheds and so on that were on the on the wharf. I think in this picture, yes. I think this boat on if I'm correct, belonged to read Bittencourt and it was called the victor. And this boat here belonged was the Ganges and belong to mo it's and read Betancourt was somebody who started a store in Ganges he had the first store in Ganges 1900. The story that we now know as mullets, well, this, this was the original one it doesn't exist anymore. The the store we now know was was built decided. It was built by by Malcolm and Purvis, who were to two fellows, two cousins from Ontario, who had married sisters and moved here. Malcolm was a blacksmith, and Purvis was a more or less more or less a businessman. And they opened for first they bought Broadwell store, which was just across the road here at Central. And then they decided that things were kind of moving towards Ganges this was in. So I guess this is about Ganges to in about 19 1900 When Bittencourt opened his first door, they opened a store here in Ganges in 1904. And mo it's bought it. That was Gilbert Mo and his mother bought it in 1907. So they laughed because Joe Malcolm died suddenly and the families moved back to Ontario. So moving right along.
Speaker 2 39:08
Oh yes, this is Musgrave landing, right. So yeah, Musgrave landing was kind of an interesting place because they, they didn't have much to do with the rest of the island. They mostly gravitated towards couch and Bay. Still some extent. There was a fellow I don't know if he's still living there, who had a boat there. And he had kept his car and couch and Bay. He never went to Ganges. He just took his boat across the couch and bang went to Duncan. So that was kind of interesting. The way the island developed, you know, there were no roads. Everybody came by boat. There were communities all around the island. I was thinking I should have had a map that showed you all the communities you know, all around the island. You know, beaver point was a community doesn't exist anymore. Christian Cove was a community or all those people working there. The steamships stopped in each of these places. picked up people, drop goods. Nothing happened in the middle. You know, everything was on the edges. And I always thought that was a very interesting thing because you don't think about that, you know, you don't think about all the things we have that they didn't have. So this is the way they built the pile drivers to build the docks. And this is one of the early ones. This was 1900 Sorry, 1895. And this was at the CVS worth was used to construct the all important landings later on transportation became more sophisticated and this river where we've always been very proud of our ferry system that started here, the side pack in 1930. The side pack was Saltspring first ferry in 1930. Launched has been a third, nagging theory, this is the launch day, and this is the docket Fulford harbour and the fight package, we'll see better pictures of this iPad. The Gulf Islands ferry company commenced operation in 1930. On its first trip, the boat carried 13 cars, the cost was 25 cents per person than $1 per car. So we've come a long way. You probably didn't have to wait for this very, because not too many people had cars. I think the sidekicks though, might exist somewhere I while ago, I remember. Somebody had a line on it's what? Oh, did it sink in the shownotes? Okay. Well, it is somewhere that aren't safe. Right? Right. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Where's it come down to? Is it Yeah.
Speaker 2 42:01
Now this one's the Princess Mary. So this we're getting into the the boats, the CPR boats. It came to Saltspring four days a week in the mid 40s and 1940s. Taking islanders to Vancouver and about eight hours. Eight hours. We had this is a quote from somebody who sailed on the boat. We had the Princess Mary the CPR boat that came four days a week, which took eight hours to go to Vancouver, the full service dining room service with napkins finger bowls, all the trimmings. For $1 You could have a state room or for $5 You could have the bridal suite. Needless to say we didn't leave the island very often. Our noses were to the grindstone, but it was a marvelous service as long as you had plenty of time. Actually, I don't leave the island all that much either, but my nose isn't to the grindstone. Life's a lot easier these days. This is the motor princess. The motor princess is about 1940 This was was the last vessel built in British Columbia by the CPR. In 1935. It was sold to the Gulf Islands ferry company for the Swartz beta Fulford run and was still in use in 1961 when BC a ferry authority took over. And this is the motor Princess coming into Ganges wharf actually sent that picture to my friend see if that little boat sitting there was the one he's gotten his bullshit. One in the front here is the second use this thing again. Okay, this is the cordwood Okay. land transportation wasn't much easier. Getting to Victoria from Saltspring was a major effort by 1895 to Victorian Sydney railway ran two trains per day in each direction along the Saanich Peninsula. The cost was 50 cents, and the trip took 50 minutes. The problem for islanders was that there was no connection between Saltspring and Sydney to catch the train, they had to hire their own boat for $1 and a half from Burgoyne bay or Vesuvius Bay. Then walk a few miles to the railway. Another alternative was to take a boat from Fulford harbour or beaver point to the railway terminus in Sydney. Leonard Tolson made this trip sounds like a great group quite an event. Leonard Tolson left us a diary, which has got fantastic stuff in it. And well, if you've read if you've read my book, you'll know I mean very heavily on these old quotes because they tell the story so much better than I could. In summer I often went down in my own small boat. The idea was to grow in the evening when there was often a land breeze and sail down to Beaver point and camp and leave there about 4am and get to Sydney in time for the train to town at 9am known as the cordwood limited it stopped each time had to load up enough cordwood for the round trip, there was a rather steep grade near elk Lake and one time when I was on board the train could not quite make it and had to back down and take another run at it. When we got near the top, the conductor asked all the men to jump out and push. And we just managed to make it the return trip was much the same. out by the evening train camp at Beaver point Leave about Dawn and be home in time for breakfast. Quite amazing, isn't it? So this is the court with limited now I'm going to do something when religion. We have a lot of the churches that were here, they're all still here. There were churches on the outer satisfy the main Christian congregations. So this is the union Church on the left and Brookline Valley schoolhouse on the right. Union church was built in aka seven by Methodist Presbyterian and Anglican volunteers working under the direction of Charles Horrell. Anglicans prefer to worship separately in the schoolhouse built in 1873. And this church subsequently became Burgoyne United Church. That's another review showing mount Maxwell in the background. The interesting thing about these pictures on this is yeah, is that if you you'll notice them in other pictures. There aren't nearly as many trees as there are today. You know? Yeah, yeah. It's interesting when when tax aide was cutting all those trees, you know, a lot of the old timers Oh, don't worry, don't worry, they grow back. And they do, don't they? I mean, we've got way more trees now than remember when I when I published that book, The History Saltspring Manson toimi said to me, you know, when I was a kid, we didn't have all these trees. Do you remember that? was
Unknown Speaker 47:00
a kid, kid on the kid on the roof? I hope you survived. Okay. And this is what it looks like. We're like to me.
Speaker 2 47:16
That's the picture today. By the way, not that church, but the bad St. Mary's has beautiful flowers in the front yard. If you haven't gone by it lately. It'll soon be too late. All the Erythronium the formula is zero. And they're mixed with some some other flowers. Colors are just gorgeous. I just thought I'd show that. It's not part of the talk. Okay, this is St. Mark's Church. And it was built. This is about 1897. It's the first Anglican church built on the island. The land was donated by Henry and Anne Stephens and the church was consecrated by Bishop George hills in 1892. And you have one today. And this is the Methodist Church, which was originally built in central in 1904. And dedicated a year later, it was moved to Ganges in 1926, a year after the Methodists were incorporated into you new United Church of Canada.
Unknown Speaker 48:23
And
Speaker 2 48:25
that's the old man's. It's an old picture. It's not a picture framing place anymore. What is it? That fables anymore? Oh, that's right. I never remember that name. Yeah, that's right. It's that new store the relatively new store. Now, the first task that settlers had to face when they arrived on Saltspring was to clear enough land to create farms and gardens. And this is how they cut the trees. They use springboards, they kind of notch in the trees and slug those boards in. Then these guys would stand on the boards with these long sauce and go back and forth until the trees came down. They probably cut the trees down faster than I could do it with a chainsaw. I'm not very good with the chainsaw. And they did that partly to get above stuff that was on the ground. But also to so they didn't have to cut quite so thick a piece. It's you know, trees get bigger, bigger as you go down on the tree. Okay, moving right along. This is Henry and our Ella and Rachael. Henry rock arrived in 1872 and Ferb and the beaver Point area. And this is what the land look like after they cut all those obnoxious trees down. It's interesting and what we many of us think of is beautiful. They just saw as an impediment to getting on with life. To the critical back just for a second. I went Rocco told me a story about how they got married. And I always like to tell that story because it's fun. They met down in the States I think may have been Seattle. And she already had a had a son. And he needed a wife. So they made a deal. She said, Well, if you adopt my son, I'll be your wife. And I guess he said, Well, if you'll be my wife, I'll give you a home and so then they moved to to the farm. You couldn't really be you couldn't really take care of a place if you didn't have two sides, male and female. So it worked out very well but I always thought that was a neat story sort of like the the guys who marry native wives to to make peace with the you know everything everything in life looks that way, doesn't it? And this next one is Alma Dan and his wife and they worked on rocket pharma in 1910. I did say earlier that a lot of Japanese were brought in to clear the line these these people were probably immigrants rather than the ones who were brought in by contract to clear the land weren't allowed to stay they had to go back they were brought in by companies that were were had set up in Victoria Okay, now we're now we're into serious this is about 8090 with the end and houses built by Escalon Betancourt so this is a large facility is large.
Speaker 2 51:46
And I gave a talk last year, I think it was last year I did that talk where we compared old pictures and new pictures. And I tried to get a new picture of this and you can't do it anymore. It's just too many trees in the way. I wanted to see what looked like today. And you know, I went to some friend's place on you know, very close, probably probably just about where this picture was taken. And you couldn't even see the beach from from their class. So that was interesting. And getting that picture looking down. You know, sand scenarios. Couldn't get that either. Okay. Now I thought that was grandma's boarding house. But just fell over here. Frank says it's it's it's serious, serious logic. Really? I could have sworn that Ivan years ago told me he identified all those people as modes and maybe it was another too much of a hill. Okay. Couldn't have done that with a builder. Okay. Okay.
Speaker 2 53:10
No, no, it's definitely not downhill. No, it's not that we have that coming up. Okay, so moving along. So this was the marketing purpose store that we talked about before. And you could see that people came in in ox carts and horses, horse and buggy. And this probably was on both day. So a lot of the people would be going down to the wharf or down at the wharf. And you can see that even back then parking was a problem.
Unknown Speaker 53:44
What's that was that Spring Drive?
Speaker 2 53:49
I don't think so. I don't think it was dry then. But I think it was dry a little later. I'm not quite sure exactly what date it was dry. It was dry at one time because there was a lot of bootlegging going on. But I mean, if if they could sell liquor off the boat, then it couldn't have been dry. So this is this is now it's now more it's probably very soon after they bought it and they put up the sign. Malcolm Purvis didn't really I don't think I've seen haven't seen any signs in the old pictures, saying Malcolm and Purvis the most most productive sign, probably announcing that they bought the store. Go gone. So this became Granny's boarding house, it was the original store, that last lap they were we have a picture coming up. Coming up the shows both the old and the new. Granny's boarding house, Jane Moloch became so that's it on the left, the new store is on the right. So when they built the new store Are Graeme JMO took it over and became Granny's boardinghouse. Lotus Rocco told me that she was the board there and when she went to high school because it just took too long to get from Rucker Park to town. So she stay in town from Monday to Friday, I guess and then go home for the weekend. Boards. Save they're also she made money there as well. Yeah. Actually, I guess then she was she was living down. She probably got men Henyk and because she was loaded Fraser then. Yeah, when she went to school. So where are we now? So this this is the house you were talking about Wendy, that's on North northern road and this belong to the Stevens. And it was a boarding house. This is about 1910. It was built by Henry Stevens, who came to Salzburg in 1884. And, you know, back in those days, there were two boarding houses. There was the the anchorman boarding house on the south end, and this one Northland and numbers of people can't came to the island state these places. So it's another one. And there's a picture of Central Hall is hall that we're in now. And this property, which was a lot bigger back then we've always wondered, what happened to it was 100 acres to begin with. There was a schoolhouse here, and it was a jail here at one point. And the cemetery, of course. That is a schoolhouse. Yeah. Right. Okay. Now we're into education. Moving right along. Since beaver point school, the school's first teacher, Mr. Levine and the school's first class in about 1885. When the school closed in 1951, it had been used continuously for classes longer than any other school in British Columbia. The renovated Little Red Schoolhouse still functions as a daycare center today. Okay, then we have Burgoyne school.
Speaker 2 57:30
And Saltspring, consolidated school opened in 1940 was built at a cost of around $30,000, half of which came from the provincial government and the rest raised locally through the nation's cash and labor and picture of it today. So ultimately Elementary.
Speaker 2 57:57
Okay, this is John Wallace house and garden and I'm going to read you a quotation from another book. This fellow came to the island, not John Moloch. But the guy who wrote this quotation I'm going to read you came to the island and was walking he was on a big walking tour. He was one of these English men who you know walk their whole lives in probably walked all over Europe. He probably walked through the Lake District and all over England, and now he was walking across British Columbia and he was walking down What now is the Fulford Ganges road and he came upon this and he was just amazed to see this. Near the end of my walk, I came to a spot where arrested bridge crossed a bubbling Brook. Looking down a grassy bank where woodland flowers poke their heads up to the sunshine. I saw a miniature spillway and a tiny pond. A few yards farther on. Through an ivy covered gateway, I caught a glimpse of a most lovely garden ablaze with flowers. I heard a voice calling the chickens to supper and so entering the gate. I met John Carter, Carter Molot 81 years old in March last and still in love with every flower in his garden. He took me around the world camp beds. You seem to love your garden, said I. My garden. It is my life, he said earnestly. I work from five in the morning till dark and I am never done with the flowers. Then his snow white hair and beard and his battered hat making him a quaint old figure. He took me to see his water rum, a simple device by which he controls all the water he needs from his never dry spring water and we stood in chatted a while at the gate and he gave me a buttonhole of pansies. Then he said, Well, young man, I must go to my chickens. I've been living all alone for 14 years, you know and I'm busy. Goodbye and come and see the old man scored and again if you pass this week you know what, I'm not sure it's somewhere doesn't house doesn't exist anymore. I read somewhere that you could still see a line of poplars where it was and but I never did find it. I was in that thing I did before where I tried to compare the old and the new I tried to find the line of poplars and I wasn't able to I even had Gail helping me she couldn't find it on your found on Google Earth. I should, if I only knew how to do Google Earth, I might have found it. Okay, next one. So this fellow's name is Jim Anderson. And he established the Owens first public picnic area site walkers hook this photo was taken around 1931 And you can see that the hook in the background. He also had a place I think earlier, maybe it was after on Isabel point. And he was he was known for his picnics there as well. So this is in the 1950s Jim Anderson tall, barefoot and carrying Saltspring special domestic tool, a broom was asked to sweep the beach down by the big rock below his property. If you think it was strange to see a man sweeping the beach it was most people find it tiresome to have to sweep their back porch but Jim Anderson made a hobby of keeping his beach clean and he was down there every morning. That beach had never been so tidy and neat. Jim love to go down to see what the tide had left for him each morning and his delight knew no bounds when the Lightship William Stewart let loose and old red spar boy. He added white stripes and placed it in an incongruous out of the way position on the Hill, a wheel of fortune, a beauty parlor. little bunches of wild poppies and ferns placed in soup tins and little hollows and old tree trunks. This was Jim Madison's little park and he delighted in having his people from the north end down for picnics over the weekends. At night high on the Hill would come the sound of Jim's trumpet as he sounded the last post to honor past war veterans. At dawn startled neighbors would be roused by a tootling Renee and the old man could play well and was sadly missed when he passed away not so very many years ago. Now that that quotation is from my rival B Hamilton wrote the first history of Saltspring and so I'm sure this was on Isabel point because B didn't write too much about the North End stores Okay.
Unknown Speaker 1:02:48
Used to have cheap and found chickens and turkeys up on the hill
Unknown Speaker 1:02:58
yeah
Unknown Speaker 1:03:00
and then he to film bugle all the way to Patterson to the cow back to the decoy Paul you built it there and bought a milk bag I don't know what it was all the time but yeah. When you when Jim got the cow back home go somewhere else later. Call and chickens and everything with the hunt
Unknown Speaker 1:03:52
and the techniques went on for a long time was right there where Mr. Grantham is still and our friends from Auckland came to live there my dad we used to own that piece of property
Unknown Speaker 1:04:15
Pearson's live they're the grants that they're just over the hill, where they mark up area where they weren't supposed to be old anything used to do with cars, I'm going to stop there
Speaker 2 1:04:40
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for sharing them. This is when years ago when I was when I was more involved with the Historical Society. Barb Lynn garden i and i Some others organized panels of old timers. And that was terrific because we got all these stories. And to me That's what makes a presentation like this. Because as I said, so my history, I didn't grow up here, I grew up in Montreal. So it's really nice that you shared that thank you
Unknown Speaker 1:05:12
used to walk all the way from his face, all the way through the place. Walker spoke about that there was a landslide, finding our place and covered the roads. And he said he could tear it off with the shovel better than the road. So he was planning to do it. And he did. He used to go and talk to a lot
Unknown Speaker 1:05:52
of stories that 25 or 25 you can multiply together and you get to do that is memory. Any tell us all sorts of stories
Speaker 2 1:06:13
why what's nice, some of these people could be remembered. Because even in the in the 20 years that I've been here, I know that there are a lot of people who've come and gone and nobody remembers them anymore. Sometimes there's a bench with a little plaque on it. You know, I led a hike for the hiking club a little while ago. And I was pointing out these benches that, you know, these people who are very actively involved in the community, and I don't think there's anybody on my crew knew about these people except me. It's kind of kind of makes you makes you Well, it's, it's interesting. Moving right along. So this is Ganges Neroli times it's kind of a neat picture. Frank has done some neat things with it
Unknown Speaker 1:07:04
and today Yeah, yeah. So then and now and that's that's the Pictorial History of Saltzman. Today's anyway
Speaker 2 1:07:28
anybody had any questions or comments or wants to share a story? Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:07:37
differently. Yeah.
Speaker 2 1:07:39
No, I didn't. We have any country's boats come eat fruit. I don't think I've ever seen a picture of a boat.
Unknown Speaker 1:07:51
When your dog would stick in cars. Yeah. And my parents would have come to them. Where were 22?
Speaker 4 1:08:03
Yeah. And I'm not sure which. Oh, it was Yeah.
Speaker 2 1:08:12
John, yeah. Yeah. Well, that was an important important area because it was where the first northern settlers were. And the the first winter. Yeah. Next door was there and and, yeah, I included a picture. There was a picture. I was going to include a big storm somehow it didn't get in. But and when Conover on Wallace Island, he went back and forth to that dock. And so it was obviously important, important dock for people who lived in that area. The only ones really matter facilities. Yeah. Any other comments or questions? Nope.
Unknown Speaker 1:08:58
Thanks very much, Charles. So the behalf of all of us. Thank you for coming. And we did get Dante's worked in
Unknown Speaker 1:09:09
here for a few minutes and you can ask for questions and we have tea and coffee if you're interested. And maybe tennis is our next meeting. So I'll see you at our last meeting this year. Thank you for coming.
Speaker 1 1:09:34
Dad had a story, but the funny part you said apparently he lived the depression class. And times and people asked him Did he study like clams eat so many says we're not really. You keep practicing you. You feel like oh,
Speaker 3 1:09:50
Charles Johnson and we're in the back.
Unknown Speaker 1:09:59
Section realizing my data which is great. Hey, you know I'm sorry I was so bad this morning. I didn't talk to you, but I know. Thanks for coming.
Unknown Speaker 1:10:14
I have a houseguest
Speaker 3 1:10:15
and it's just awkward I canceled everything else it's a friend of mine and I was just going to pick them up it was just coming so I was using in my recycling but we almost got your way know you're so
Unknown Speaker 1:10:40
blessed we always call her Hi
Speaker 2 1:10:53
Astro Boy What do you think happened my wife and I came out offers wow I've never really Granberry again oh well come on later Later probably go with the high 40s and they were very very very cut off there's some very interesting stories about the time but it was also a kind of kind of a dark patch or a
Speaker 2 1:11:31
little bit of everything else and that's what the way it was back in and the first people I guess he settled in there I guess putting them in after elections. So the land was cheap wasn't very good at first but pretty good. No, but people really scratch them
Speaker 3 1:11:49
out so driving around the trees Yeah. But the present interesting there are just two people in the crowd trying to get
Speaker 2 1:12:01
I was thinking that we could reach somebody did a history that comes up here yeah, we're going through a lot about memory and I got a lot of stories from you and I recorded a few in my book Yeah, we did we had a bowl of sales you know further up because at
Unknown Speaker 1:12:36
Westlake the legal team that came out right even when the
Unknown Speaker 1:12:53
scales yeah yeah.
Unknown Speaker 1:13:01
And also I recommend is about the survey people that wrote that book and also you
Speaker 4 1:13:24
unfortunately he had his notes on top like
Unknown Speaker 1:13:29
you think it left her obscured?
Unknown Speaker 1:13:42
This was behaving deteriorate.
Unknown Speaker 1:13:45
Yeah, it was
Unknown Speaker 1:13:51
funny things
Unknown Speaker 1:13:57
sorry. So this should go away.
